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Author Topic: About to throw in the towel  (Read 4005 times)

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Offline SweetReefOH

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About to throw in the towel
« on: January 05, 2018, 18:03:16 »

Came home today and the blue banshee i got last Saturday is STN’ing.

I have had stable numbers for 2 weeks. I am at my wits end with what the problem is at this point. So defeating....

Offline Keith92

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Re: About to throw in the towel
« Reply #1 on: January 05, 2018, 18:26:38 »
I can't imagine what you are going through. I have lost stuff over the years but nothing that has taken out all of my stuff. Have you done a 100% water change?

Offline SweetReefOH

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Re: About to throw in the towel
« Reply #2 on: January 05, 2018, 18:49:20 »
Keith I am about at that point. But I’m afraid that might kill all my LPS too. Plus I don’t have the means to mix and heat 60g of water.

Offline Keith92

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Re: About to throw in the towel
« Reply #3 on: January 05, 2018, 18:55:03 »
I have two 40 gallon drums and heaters you are welcome to use.  I use a mag 5 pump to pump it out. You can do a 120 tank from start to finish in 25 minutes. Most of you corals would be exposed less than 15 minutes.

Offline SweetReefOH

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Re: About to throw in the towel
« Reply #4 on: January 05, 2018, 19:08:33 »
I appreciate the offer. Have you ever had to do a big WC like that? I think it’s the only option I have at this point.

I need to rescape anyway to make sure I’m getting good flow around the rocks.

Offline lazylivin

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Re: About to throw in the towel
« Reply #5 on: January 05, 2018, 19:52:24 »
Sorry you are going through this.

Offline SweetReefOH

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Re: About to throw in the towel
« Reply #6 on: January 05, 2018, 20:15:57 »
Thanks Brian. I am just frustrated at not finding an answer. I know I started the problem with the light issue and over feeding. But Since ive had that under control, I really expected new acros to do OK.

Offline CoralBeauties

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Re: About to throw in the towel
« Reply #7 on: January 05, 2018, 20:46:35 »
Looks like tip burn to me.  I have found in my tank most stn has been from the base up.  How high are you running your alk at?  Have you checked your test kit against another kit?  I have a hanna alk meter you can come out and get it and ck against your kit. I think alot of us have been where you are at at one time or another.  I know my self I have been so frustrated before I was half tempted to take a hammer to the tank.  I also have several 55 gallon drums you can use to make up a large water change if you want to try that route.  I know in the past Lazy has solved issues with large changes.  The biggest issue with a large water change like keith mentioned is trying to match up water parameters close to what your tank is at.  The three I am mostly concerned with during a large change is temp, alk, and salinity.
Jeff

Offline SweetReefOH

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Re: About to throw in the towel
« Reply #8 on: January 05, 2018, 21:02:00 »
Thanks Jeff, I think I am going to have to try the WC. I took my water to Brian Saturday. His tests were dead on to what my kits showed. Here are my parameters for the last week.

78-78.5 degrees
1.026 Refractometer/Apex
9.01-9.09 alk Hanna
420-450 Ca. Red Sea
Am 0 API
NO2=0 API
NO3=20  API
PO4= .09-.03 Hanna

My PAR at that Banshee is about 400. So I don’t think it’s too much light. Hence why I am so frustrated. I am diligent with testing, water changes, etc. It’s got to be something I am unaware of. Maybe a bacteria, fungus, or something that I picked up from the swap along with the nudibranchs (nudibranchs never made it to the display, only QT). I’m baffled


Offline SweetReefOH

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Re: About to throw in the towel
« Reply #9 on: January 05, 2018, 21:20:59 »
PM sent to you Keith

I have two 40 gallon drums and heaters you are welcome to use.  I use a mag 5 pump to pump it out. You can do a 120 tank from start to finish in 25 minutes. Most of you corals would be exposed less than 15 minutes.

Offline thepipbull

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Re: About to throw in the towel
« Reply #10 on: January 05, 2018, 21:38:35 »
i agree with jeff.... just looks like a little tip burn...happens to me at times and always pops back sometimes i get a little alage growth and nip the tip off.... also white tips can be new growth to but not the case if its new...and all sps and tanks are different ive had a small colony in my tanks for 2 years and just now sprouted a new branch...hobby can be frustrating at times and sometimes over thinking and over reacting hurt us more.... i would let it be and make sure something is really wrong before doing anything....

Offline CoralBeauties

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Re: About to throw in the towel
« Reply #11 on: January 05, 2018, 22:21:29 »
I think if I were to do anything you might want to drop the alk just a tad.  maybe around the mid 8 range.  I know from my tank when I accidentally get my alk above 9 my corals just dont seem happy.  I am sure other people run higher alk without any problems but when natural seawater is in the 7 range I dont like to push it too high.  I just found this post on alk.  ( Like phos and nitrates if you are running ULN and you have higher alk IME you will burn the tips of your SPS. NSW alk is 7)
since you are running uln tank maybe alk is your problem.
Jeff
 

Offline SweetReefOH

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Re: About to throw in the towel
« Reply #12 on: January 05, 2018, 22:30:50 »
I used to run ULN. I would get no reading on PO4 or nitrate. But, I had a tank full of SPS consuming any nutrients I did have. Since the downward spiral, I wouldn’t say I run ULN anymore. My nitrate is staying between 20-40 and PO4 is .03-.09 because I’ve lost a lot of SPS and it’s not being consumed as quickly. Do you think 9 alk is too high for those nutrient levels? What are your average nutrient levels Jeff?

Offline SweetReefOH

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Re: About to throw in the towel
« Reply #13 on: January 05, 2018, 22:59:22 »
PM sent

i agree with jeff.... just looks like a little tip burn...happens to me at times and always pops back sometimes i get a little alage growth and nip the tip off.... also white tips can be new growth to but not the case if its new...and all sps and tanks are different ive had a small colony

Offline CoralBeauties

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Re: About to throw in the towel
« Reply #14 on: January 05, 2018, 23:01:36 »
If it were me I would try and lower your nitrate some maybe to the 5-10 level, your phos is good, mine alot of times is in the .1 range.  At this point I would lower your alk supplement some and shoot for mid 8's.  I dont think your nitrate level would harm any corals but you might start to see some algae issues.  Is the banshee the only coral you are having issues with?  The big issue with a major water change is most salt mixes have high alk levels.  Ive done it a few times and had to lower the alk with muratic acid to get it down to a normal range before I could do the water change.  Since Im just around the corner from you if you need anything just holler.
Jeff

Offline SweetReefOH

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Re: About to throw in the towel
« Reply #15 on: January 05, 2018, 23:47:40 »
Thank you for the insight Jeff. I have been obsessed with keeping the phos down because of that RHF thread I read. But if you are experiencing .1 and not showing issues, maybe my nitrate is what is causing problems as you are suggesting.

I think I’m going to go with Keith’s recommendation on the massive water change. Humphrey and Brian have both said they do that occasionally just to “reset” their parameters. I think my existing Corals are shocked because of the rise in nutrient levels but that doesn’t explain the STN in recent Corals. So I think there may be something involved that I’m not testing for and a big WC should correct that as well.

I really appreciate all the input. It does give me different angles to look at. I just want my tank back to the  Oct 14th state in which everything was thriving...

Offline Agame43

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Re: About to throw in the towel
« Reply #16 on: January 06, 2018, 00:09:02 »


Jesse I have two 36g Brutes that you can use, I have one 200W heater as well that you can use. Let me know, I can run them up in the AM if needed. I can bring RO water as well!!!

Offline CoralBeauties

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Re: About to throw in the towel
« Reply #17 on: January 06, 2018, 00:21:11 »
I dont think the nitrates are causing any issues other then possibly some algae issues if it remains at those levels.  I think Steve also did large water changes.  I kindof follow pipbull with letting thinks settle out.  Like I mentioned earlier I would just drop the alk alittle bit.  If you decide to do a large change you can come by or I can bring you the 55 gallon drum that I have.  It has a float level cut off in it already so you can hook up your ro to it and let it go.  I think I have heaters also to heat up the water.  Just be careful with your parameters in the new water, dont want to stress the corals even more then they already are after being out of the water for 20 min or so.
Jeff

Offline CoralBeauties

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Re: About to throw in the towel
« Reply #18 on: January 06, 2018, 21:15:37 »
What did you decide on doing with the tank?  Keep us posted on how things play out.
Jeff

Offline Agame43

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Re: About to throw in the towel
« Reply #19 on: January 06, 2018, 22:13:20 »


  Jeff posted above that the tissue loss or "burn on top" of you coral does not look like RTN or STN? I would have to agree to some extent, it does not look like what I have had before? The one episode that I had seemed to start on the base and work its way up the skeleton of the coral piece. Not claiming to be an expert by no means. Have a look at the product in the pic attached, Reef Grow RTN Destroyer, I did use this once before with good results. Would say that I probably did a water change as well as you have mentioned. Keep us posted on what you want to do or if you need any help!

Offline Agame43

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Re: About to throw in the towel
« Reply #20 on: January 06, 2018, 22:55:48 »


  Jesse, food for thought, have you looked into this scenario: high light/alk with low nutrients? Did you by chance run into this monster by accident and are now seeing the results? I would need to go back and look at more of your postings? I stumbled across this "white tip acro" thread on R2R and they mention this as a good possibility. I do recall that you did have high alk like I run and you did do a good light program change.
 Rick

Offline SweetReefOH

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Re: About to throw in the towel
« Reply #21 on: January 07, 2018, 09:15:44 »
Thanks for the info Rick. I’ve basically narrowed it down to 3 possibilities since my phosphate/nitrate issues do not seem to have been the problem.
1. My UV light is too high and it is burning the Corals (although I ran UV full power previously). I’ve been taking it down incrementally the last few days and the STN seems to have stopped on the Banshee.
2. There is some kind of chemical reaction that may be a result from the Ca precipitate I had a few months ago that is polluting the water
3. I got some kind of bacterial/viral infection from something I got at the frag swap.

Several members have suggested doing a 100% Water change to “correct” anything that might be wrong in the water column, that I can’t see or test for. I think that is probably my last resort. Keith was nice enough to loan me the equipment to do a massive water change. I am gonna be mixing the water today. I also got a lower alk salt from Keith that will allow me to mix my salt and his in order to get the SG & Alk exactly the same as my water. I cant do a 100% change because of my livestock, but I’m looking to get at least an 80% change done in less than 15 minutes.

Offline yinyang

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Re: About to throw in the towel
« Reply #22 on: January 21, 2018, 08:35:17 »
Hope you everything goes well for you, been through stuff like this before.
I have couple question for you(just try to help out)
What kind of lighting are you using?LED?
when you get your sps from the swap to home did you go through SPS  light acclimation? 
the reason for the light acclimation is because everybody are using different type of LED light, your light might be too strong than the person who sold you the coral(that will result sps bleaching like this).
the best method is placing SPS in the sand bed, then slower move it up.there is lots article in the RC about how to do SPS  light acclimation.

Offline SweetReefOH

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Re: About to throw in the towel
« Reply #23 on: February 27, 2018, 20:47:49 »
UPDATE: I think I’m finally back in the game!!

I’m glad I didn’t give up because I am so happy to see what I have left coming back strong and quick and the frags I’ve purchased from Brian and Pipbull over the last 3 weeks are all doing fantastic. Not a single loss.

The bacteria, the lighting mishap, the carbon experience.... It was all a GREAT, but expensive, learning experience. But I am optimistic that I am heading in a better direction!

Offline CoralBeauties

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Re: About to throw in the towel
« Reply #24 on: February 27, 2018, 21:07:59 »
Good to hear.  It can get really frustrating but you just have to keep after it.
jeff

Offline Agame43

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Re: About to throw in the towel
« Reply #25 on: February 27, 2018, 21:36:04 »


Jesse, really good to hear that you have it on the right track - Continued Good Luck!!!   :sign0098:

Offline Heinbaughb

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Re: About to throw in the towel
« Reply #26 on: February 27, 2018, 21:43:37 »
Great job dude! You've got this.

Offline lazylivin

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Re: About to throw in the towel
« Reply #27 on: February 27, 2018, 22:53:29 »
 :drink

Offline SweetReefOH

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Re: About to throw in the towel
« Reply #28 on: February 28, 2018, 07:31:05 »
Thanks everyone!

 

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