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Author Topic: Im a DIY idiot (can this project be saved)  (Read 3141 times)

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Offline Amstar

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Im a DIY idiot (can this project be saved)
« on: October 12, 2008, 09:31:35 »
well I started to build my stand.  I did not take it into effect the sump is the same width as the main tank. so when I went to put in the braces along the stand (the front of it) it pushed the sump about 1/2" off the bottom of the stand and there is no room to put brace all along the front.  Can I even use this design or do I need to start over and just burn the wood in the fire pit.

I can put braces as the end of the sump



the braces in the front


Offline verper

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Re: Im a DIY idiot (can this project be saved)
« Reply #1 on: October 12, 2008, 10:38:22 »
That is a 125 gal tank we are looking at?

Only thing I can think of would be to switch out your upper frame boards to a hardwood like oak and do away with the center braces all together.  You would still have to use 2x6's and it would be pricey.  Good news is that you wouldn't need a center brace at all.  Seal the oak boards well prior to installation so that there will be almost no movement.  And yes, you would have to change all of the upper frame boards out.  Same species of wood expand and contract at the same rate.

My 120 sits on a 1x4 oak frame that I made with no center brace.  If I had a longer tank I would build it the same way I'm telling you, only with 2x hardwood lumber throughout.  I really like the idea of no center brace.  You don't see this too often from manufactures because of cost.  I looked at several AGA stands and was amazed at their assembly was done.  Not nearly as strong as I would have done it.

I know the frame is not done, but I see a couple of other concerns.   You need support directly under the upper frame.  Right now you have the vertical 2x6s inside the frame.  Add another one right at the corner so the weight is not supported only by your fasteners.   And the fasteners.....those look like nails.  Ditch them for 3 or 3.5" deck screws and glue every joint.  You're going to have to become a furniture builder.  ;D


Offline Amstar

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Re: Im a DIY idiot (can this project be saved)
« Reply #2 on: October 12, 2008, 12:27:47 »
alright.  yes the sump is a 125.

the main tank is going to be a 150 gallon tank.

I will look into the oak.

I agree on the support under the upper frame.  I was in the process of putting the supports under the main frame when I decided to throw the sump in the stand to see what it looks like.  well thats when I saw/recognized that it hung over and was not going to be able to make supports (middle supports) only the back of the stand.  the stand will be behind a wall so I can make it look like a monster if I have to.

I agree on the fasteners, I have the deck screws was just trying to get the framework up then go back and use the screws. 

so there is no way by adding more support along the front (like picture #2) and support under the frame will it work?? because of no support along the back of the tank (pic #1) 

im ready to just scrap this whole 150 build (b/c Im and idiot) and just stick with my 75 gallon

Offline verper

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Re: Im a DIY idiot (can this project be saved)
« Reply #3 on: October 12, 2008, 13:13:53 »
I agree on the support under the upper frame.  I was in the process of putting the supports under the main frame when I decided to throw the sump in the stand to see what it looks like. 
 
I thought you would, but just thought I've cover the point.

Quote
so there is no way by adding more support along the front (like picture #2) and support under the frame will it work?? because of no support along the back of the tank (pic #1) 

Correct.  Once the water is added to the tank, you put a lot of stress on the silicone caulk holding it together.  That pine 2x6 will deflect way too much in the center of a 6' opening to give enough support to a filled tank.  It will look like it is doing its job because it will be tight to the tank trim.  However it will not be giving any real support to the rear center of your tank.  May work fine for 6mths, 1 yr, or maybe 2 yrs.  But it will cause the silicone to fail sooner than if it was properly supported.

Quote
im ready to just scrap this whole 150 build (b/c Im and idiot) and just stick with my 75 gallon

Don't do that.  This is only a small bump in the road.  Your two choices are to rebuild the stand or find a different sump.  Swapping out sumps may be your cheaper choice but the stand is also quite doable.


I also wonder how long a 6' tank full of water would last if it were supported only on the ends?  Maybe someone has tested this before.

Offline Amstar

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Re: Im a DIY idiot (can this project be saved)
« Reply #4 on: October 12, 2008, 13:28:50 »
okay so do I need to build the whole thing out of oak for me to be able to not have center braces? or just the two frames (top and bottom)



I like the idea of using the 125 as a sump (I got it dirt dirt dirt cheap) and the fact that I can use it when I upgrade to a bigger tank was well.

I am going to go to lowes later and look at the idea of going all oak frame.  can i use pine as the supports or go with oak as well.

or is all the pine i have now going to go in the fire pit for next weekend.








Offline verper

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Re: Im a DIY idiot (can this project be saved)
« Reply #5 on: October 12, 2008, 13:38:32 »
Just the top frame has to be 2x hardwood to span the 6' opening.  The rest of the frame will work.  I personally like hardwood for the entire frame, but there have been many, many stands made out of pine 2x lumber.  You may have to wait and go to a place like Requarth Lumber to find any 2x material although you could glue two 1x6s together if needed.  You might call Requarth and see if they even have 2x in stock.  A lot of the 2x material these days is not surfaced on 4 sides so finding it may be difficult around the Dayton area.  Requarth will make whatever you want for a price.  :o

Offline verper

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Re: Im a DIY idiot (can this project be saved)
« Reply #6 on: October 12, 2008, 13:40:18 »
And someone else can chime in if they have some experience as to why this won't work.  I don't see why not, but maybe I'm missing something.

slandis3

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Re: Im a DIY idiot (can this project be saved)
« Reply #7 on: October 12, 2008, 15:37:48 »
heres a pic os a stand we made out of pine 2x6. We put down supports on the back but none in the front. His tank has been moved once and been running for 2 years without any problems, but there was no way a 125 would fit under there because it would stick out of the stand.
« Last Edit: November 14, 2010, 08:25:47 by slandis3 »

Offline Amstar

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Re: Im a DIY idiot (can this project be saved)
« Reply #8 on: October 12, 2008, 17:04:28 »
that is exactly what I ran into.  with the main tank and the 125 being the same size the 125 stuck out with the supports being along the one side (the front) but not the back.

however I compelety tore down that stand and I am in the process of re-building the frames again.  I have made the bottom one and have enough room for the supports (for under the frame) in the corners as well as along the lenght of it for the front and back and I will be able to get the 125 in there as well.


so hopefully when I get the top frame done, everthing will work like I have in my mind, but then again I thought it would the first time.

Let you know in 24 hours how it goes.

it should be intersting when I start to plumb the darn thing if I cant even get this right.



Offline UD Flyer

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Re: Im a DIY idiot (can this project be saved)
« Reply #9 on: October 12, 2008, 17:28:23 »
Well, it sounds like you have things going in the right direction now. But, how do you plan on getting the 125 out if something were to ever happen, like a leak or something of the sort?



Offline Amstar

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Re: Im a DIY idiot (can this project be saved)
« Reply #10 on: October 12, 2008, 18:04:19 »
the braces (in the back since the tank is going in the wall) will be glued and mounted with brackets.  So all i have to do is unscrew the brackets, then smack the braces with a hammer to get the glue loose.

once the tank is pulled, put the braces back in for the main tank as the repairs or replace sump is done.


Offline Amstar

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Re: Im a DIY idiot (can this project be saved)
« Reply #11 on: October 19, 2008, 20:24:18 »
I think I saved it.




center braces




braces in the inside of the frame





Offline Amstar

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Re: Im a DIY idiot (can this project be saved)
« Reply #12 on: October 19, 2008, 20:25:28 »
braces on the outside of the frame




stand covered (still need to drill holes for the reef ready tank


Offline verper

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Re: Im a DIY idiot (can this project be saved)
« Reply #13 on: October 19, 2008, 21:16:31 »
Looks good.

Offline Amstar

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Re: Im a DIY idiot (can this project be saved)
« Reply #14 on: October 19, 2008, 21:33:31 »
now I am building two durso standpipes.  then the start of the rest of the plumbing.

slandis3

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Re: Im a DIY idiot (can this project be saved)
« Reply #15 on: October 19, 2008, 21:46:25 »
how do you get the sump out?

Offline Amstar

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Re: Im a DIY idiot (can this project be saved)
« Reply #16 on: October 28, 2008, 11:54:35 »
the center brackets are just screwed in.  I remove four screws on the braces and pull it out.  actually getting ready to pull it out to start and drill it so I can start on the plumbing

Offline lazylivin

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Re: Im a DIY idiot (can this project be saved)
« Reply #17 on: October 29, 2008, 01:07:20 »
Amstar, you got any updates or new pics?

Offline Amstar

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Re: Im a DIY idiot (can this project be saved)
« Reply #18 on: November 01, 2008, 18:30:00 »
actually I am just trying to finish up my durso standpipes, then I am going to start drawing my baffels on the side of the sump with an "washable" marker to make sure that is where I want them.  I am then going to mark where I want to have holes drilled (for external pumps, auto-topoff, skimmer return, water change/drain) 

finished the egg-crate top to the 150 so I will not have any jumpers. 

I am trying to determine how I am going to plumb the dual stage GFO/Carbon reactor I just bought.


 

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