Rayk's 180 upgrade Stupidity

[rayk]

So I've dreamed and planned and dreamed for a 8 ft x 36 inch deep, 374 gallon monster.....   not to be just yet.  Job uncertainty, economy, declining dollar, kid in college.... all lead to putting off that dream for just a bit.  Job uncertainty is probably the biggest reason for all this, not that my job is going away, but my company has been talking about a move/promotion to Boulder, Colorado, possibly when my son gets out of High School in 2 years (and another one in college).  

But, I'm sick of a few things.  First, I don't like the length of my 120.  While it is great for a mainly reef aquarium, I also like a few active fish, wrasses and such, and they just don't have far to go until they turn around or disappear behind rock.  About a year ago, one of the local retailers had a sale on large aquariums, so I picked up a 125 pretty cheap, and put it at my work office as a FOWverylittleLR, HOT Remora, etc.  When we moved offices to a newer, nicer building, I decided my homemade stand and no hood wouldn't look very good, so it moved to my basement for storage.  But one thing I learned, is that I absolutely love a 6 ft long aquarium.  That extra 2 feet just makes a huge difference in the swimming patterns of the fish.  

My original plan as of a week ago was to drill the 125 myself, add a calfo overflow.  The second thing I don't like, as I've been reading up on, is the overflow system that all-glass uses.  While I'm sure it is fine, I'm going to go for a much longer overflow, therefore skimming much more of the top layer, and try and direct feed that into my skimmer.  If I can't direct feed, I am at least going to isolate that water better than my current sump.  

But, that same local retailer is trying to clear out all their large aquariums from the stores, so I picked up a 180 for a hell of a deal.  So, here are the design goals (sorry, the engineer is sneaking out).  1.  Has to be in the basement.  We have alot of room upstairs and some cool places, but we have long joists spanning the floor, so almost anywhere either gets alot of direct sunlight or will bounce with the floor.  2.  Has to be somewhat out of the way in the basement, for resale later.  My wife is a Realtor, so she understands this pretty good.  IF, big IF, we could redesign an area of the basement 'around' the aquarium, maybe a wet bar Caribbean style, etc., then it could be a centerpiece.  But since we still need to redo kitchen and master bath first, that is WAY down the list.  So it needs to be in a 'hobby area', just like a wood shop or model railroad or whatever.  Or so she says... hell, she's letting me put it somewhere at least, can't complain too much if I'm confined to my man-cave.  

More explanation when I link the photos....  

[rayk]

So, where this is going in the basement.  We have a back room that was a wood shop for the previous owner, but became a storage area and 'fish room' for us.  The problem is, the 'fish room' is totally not visible from the basement, so anybody who even wants to see the aquarium walks through our neatly organized storage area....  

Here is a picture of the basement.  It is a mess right now as I had to move stuff out of the storage area to start working.  The blue tape lines on the far back wall behind the air hockey table is where the entrance to the fish room will be, just to the right of the door to the storage area.   The aquarium will be 'in the wall' about 10 feet into this room, allowing us to put some cozy chairs.  


Other info, the couch in the foreground is looking at the big screen.  The 125 is there to the left, but it doesn't stay there.  It will be used during the transfer process, then sold off.  

[rayk]

Here is the current 'fish room', with my lonely 120.  The stand is 'about' where the 180 will go, and I'll frame up 2 foot of wall on either side of it, and dry wall it in.  I am going to put my light rack on some kind of sliding system, but haven't figured that out yet.  I have to contend with the beam in the ceiling.  Thinking about using garage door rails.   I'd like it just to move up and down on some kind of pulley system, but I think the beam is going to not allow that. 



yes, for now, I will still only have 1 400 Watt MH over the center of the tank, with some VHOs for support.  May even wire up my other Icecap 660 ballast with some daylight bulbs.  Not sure yet.  One step at a time. 

[rayk]

And the final picture for today.  This is where the opening into the rest of the basement will be going.  Just another note, the basement wall is not straight, it dips out for the bay window upstairs, which is why that beam is there.  So to the left of this hole in my drywall is the outer cement wall, and a nice little notch for cozy chair.



Not sure on timing on all this.  I tend to get going, then run into a delay and progress stops for a month because I get busy with work or real estate investing or something.

But the 180 is sitting in the garage, by tonite I should have a big hole in my wall, and sometime this week I hope to try and make my external overflow box out of acrylic.  If the acrylic holds water, i'll be ordering the hole drilling bits and bulksheads from glass-holes.com. 

[Lost Floridian]

It looks like your going to be very busy for the next few weeks, months, your gona be busy for the next year!

But it seems like your on your way, and I cant wait for the grand opening!

[HUNGER]

with all that work u will just be evern more happyer when its all done and its going to look great  when done

[lazylivin]

I am jealous of your fish room. Must be nice to have that kind of space to work with. Looking forward to seeing it progress as I love the 6' width as well.

[rayk]

Took off a little early today, and ........  put a huge hole in the wall.  No turning back now.   Funny, when I rehab a house, I usually hire folks to get it done faster and usually correctly.  For some reason, when it's my own not-for-profit project, I suffer through this myself.  Only one small cut in my left hand, which won't affect typing tomorrow at work.   Now, since I have a wire in the way, will switch to acrylic project for tonite until my uncle advised on the re-wiring. 

From the basement family area looking in:


Closer:


And the view from inside the room, looking out onto the mess....  poor sixth grader wanted to have friends over Friday nite.... but we are disaster central.

[jd]

Oh man, this is a RC-esque thread already. I cannot wait too see your results! Please keep it coming!

[HUNGER]

yup no turning back now

[rayk]

After having an acrylic confeti party in my driveway and failing miserably at making a square cut on my makeshift workbench, I have given up on the acrylic overflow box.  I'm starting to wonder if the acrylic I got is too thin anyways.  So, looks like ordering precut 3/8" glass on Monday for the external overflow box.  I really liked the idea of water-testing an entire acrylic box versus actually making the glass box right on the back of the aquarium, and not water testing until bulkheads are in place.  I still may see if someone can manufacture it for me, but at this point, I think I'm safer with glass (note this thread is not in the DIY forum on purpose).   On the plus side, I'll be able to drill the glass bottom of the overflow before I put it in place, so if I screw that up, can always order new glass for just that peice.  Anybody know good glass shops in the area?

We should be framing up the doorway to the new aquarium viewing room this weekend, moving a power wire, and possibly even framing up the wall where the aquarium will go. 

I'll order the glass bits from glass-holes.com on Monday as well, because regardless of external overflow box material, I still need three holes in the back of my 180. 

- Rayk

[rayk]

Okay, finally got the drill bits ordered, glass peices, etc.  Should get things rolling again this weekend.  ya ya, I know, its been a month+....  For anyone wondering, although I highly doubt it, we had a family vacation/cruise get in the way of this project, then the very next week end (April 10th) I injured my shoulder snowboarding in Colorado.  I am finally able to raise my arm a bit, MRI came back today negative so no surgery.  Construction/destruction begins anew.  The wife and kids are plenty happy with the 3 month+ long construction process in the basement.... 

- rayk
livin large in the Creek of Beavers

[rayk]

I posted the glass peices for the external overflow box in the DIY section, under my original thread.  I'll have some of the final assembly here.  But for now, just had another small algae outbreak, with Nitrates reading 0 ppm, Phosphates at 0 ppm, 7 TDS on my RO/DI water, so I just replaced the DI resin and back to 0, but 7 ain't bad.   One explanation that I'm seeing alot is that my algae is so efficient, it is using the Nitrates and Phosphates before I can read them.  Probable.  Also, reading how folks don't have to clean their glass after upgrading skimmers, so I said screw it, time for a bigger skimmer.  Going to need one with the new tank anyways, and probably needed one sooner.  I have an AquaC 180, and although it pulls alot of scum, I'm sure there is more.  

I didn't do a lot of research, just asked around a bit, read some forums.  Not ready to debate the decision, because I doubt I can defend it, but ended up getting one of the last MDX250A's today from Marine Solutions.  They no longer work with SWC, although Jeff is designing some of his own skimmers, so they don't have many left.  I wasn't real thrilled about getting a 'close out', but hey, read good things about the skimmers and Marine Solutions, so...   They even assembled it on site while the kids and I looked at corals and fish, so just brought it home, dropped it in the sump and fired that baby up.  Didn't worry about vinegar break in, it will get there eventually...    


Initially, just dropped it in a rubbermaid tub on top of some live rock in the skimmer.  I will construct something more permanent out of PVC when the 180 gets in place and we move the sump.  

[rayk]

One thing I've noticed so far is obviously the bubble difference between the two skimmers.  Just from an 'oxygenation' perspective, this has to be better... 




versus the AquaC 180


and together:

[HUNGER]

so the bubble king is better hummmmmmm

[lazylivin]

That is a really nice skimmer, I am sure you will be happy with it.

[rayk]

Hrm.... 1 week break in period eh??   maybe not on my slimy tank!   18 hours after install and got gunk, and the silly thing isn't even leveled in the sump yet. 

[HUNGER]

that is good

[lazylivin]

I think it's time to rename this thread Rayk. 

[rayk]

Rename the thread?  Surely you jest.  I'll just have to give you an update to justify the name once again:

Yep, Mother's Day, and gift to the wife is stay outta her hair and actually make progress on this dang tank thing in the basement.  I was going to put up my wall studs and drywall today, but then I figured I better make some progress on this tank, since I could very well break it and who knows if I could find another 180 as cheap as I did this one.  May end with different size, or just using the 125 sitting here.

So, the plastic bracing on the top needs to come off.  I want eurobracing anyways, without the plastic center braces, but my external overflow box demands it also.  That process started today.   

I don't recommend this to anyone, but this is what I did:

Materials:
-  razor blades, razor blades and more razor blades
-  good razor knife, preferably with some kind of finger grip hanle. $8 one versus a $3 one, belief me, your fingers will thank you.
-  putty knife. 
-  one box of band-aids or other blood-stopping mechanism. 

The key here seems to be sharp razor blades.  Call me silly, but they work so much better than dull ones.  Change frequently.  If you had 2 knifes and had someone changing blades while you cut, then handed you the new blade as soon as they got it installed, that would be best!   

Process I used:  didn't get photos of all of it, sorry.
1.  Widdle away at one corner, to get to the glass.  This will take a bit, and several blades.  You have to widdle from the inside and on the outside corner. 

2.  The easiest way seems to be to score the top of the bracing just about on the edge of the glass (to the outside).  It seems to want to break here.   Again, lots of razor blades.

3.  Getting started in the corner is the hardest part really.  I had to wiggle the putty knife in, to start breaking off the side of the bracing.  The goal here was to get to the top of the glass.   

4.  Once the sides are off, you can easily access the silicone on the top of the glass holding the bracing on. 

Belief me, I tried 10 different things to pry the first section of brace off.  I even used a wood block and a hammer.  Didn't want to budge.  Only way was to cut the sides off, and get at the silicone that way.  Was pretty easy, refreshing blades.  Maybe 3 blade changes per side. 


Getting started in a corner.  I didn't show the scoring with the knife, but you can see where I cut it on the top edge.


Little further.


Sides are off, so the putty knife can separate the top of the bracing from the top of the glass. 


And... its off. 

Now for the razor blade scraping of the silicone, some kind of acetone rub, and maybe a light sanding with something....

[rayk]

Oh, also, now that that bracing is off, I'm getting other crazy ideas.  My original plan was to run a coast-to-coast overflow, internal, about 1 inch in depth.  My external overflow box is 3 feet by 7 inches by 7 inches and will attach to the back via silicone.  To get the water from the coast-to-coast into the external overflow, I was just going to drill some holes (3 probably) in the back, the same size as my 1 1/2" bulkhead holes.

Several problems with this idea now.  First, since I'm going to add a 3 inch eurobrace, I won't be able to get inside the coast-to-coast for any kind of cleaning.  Not sure I'll need to clean it, but for sure need to hide it now, and the plan was to hide it with a thin sheet of black acrylic.

What would be nice, and really crazy, since I have the trim off, is to go ahead and just make the back wall of the tank the coast-to-coast, and use a full 6 foot by 7 inch wide by 7 inch deep overflow box.  I will research how hard it might be to trim off lets say 1/2" the entire length of the back glass... hrm... sounds ominous already.  I've read folks to it easy with rotozip and glass ceramic tile bit.  I have a weaker dremel.  We'll see... 

- rayk

[cyberwollf]

I won't be able to get inside the coast-to-coast for any kind of cleaning.  Not sure I'll need to clean it,

I've already had to get a fish out of mine

[slandis3]

Your build looks good so far. Be ready for some sticker shock when you look at the price of the diamond rotor zip bits i think they are $36 each  I tried to cut some glass with diamond bits in a dremel and it took for ever to get through 1/4" glass.

[KeepOnReefin]

Your build looks good so far. Be ready for some sticker shock when you look at the price of the diamond rotor zip bits i think they are $36 each  I tried to cut some glass with diamond bits in a dremel and it took for ever to get through 1/4" glass.

How long is forever? I have a diamond dremel bit, and I need a small piece cut.

[rayk]

Hrm, I have a dremel and the bits already.  Only used it once to cut a small bulkhead hole on my 30 gallon refuge.  Got some example pictures:


dremel with the guide thing..... i have that.... somewhere.... dang.


Weir Almost cut through (example, NOT mine)


Weir finished...  (example, NOT mine)

Still not sure about this method.  Have to think about it.  But given eurobracing, which now MUST happen, I won't be able to get to an internal coast-to-coast.