high salinity

[larrynews]

so have had trouble with a few fish dying lately, newer fish that i had added, so i checked the salinity and found it was 1.030 would that be high enough to kill them? i am slowly lowering it back to about 1.025 the fish that have been in there are ok. i'm guessing because they have beenin there since the slow raising of the salinity

[lazylivin]

Unlikely the salinity contributed to there death. That is not all that high.

[Rayman]

1.030  may not be to high if you run towards the high side, and i am no expert on the matter at all, but i am wondering if it is the acclamation process and time, because if the LFS is stocking these new fish in say 1.021 water and then you think you are adding them to 1.025 which is really 1.030 you would be looking at a .009 difference compared to a .004 discrepancy at worst , so maybe the acclamation would now warrant more time than before and the fish in the tank have become used to the change slowly over time therefore are unaffected . I would slowly drop it down though to where you need it , and i am not sure if this is the culprit or not just my thoughts , i am sure someone with a better understanding will chime in.

sorry to hear this bad news and good luck figuring it out.

[larrynews]

they lived a few days and it looked like they were eating, who knows it is a crazy hobby

[lazylivin]

1.030  may not be to high if you run towards the high side, and i am no expert on the matter at all, but i am wondering if it is the acclamation process and time, because if the LFS is stocking these new fish in say 1.021 water and then you think you are adding them to 1.025 which is really 1.030 you would be looking at a .009 difference compared to a .004 discrepancy at worst , so maybe the acclamation would now warrant more time than before and the fish in the tank have become used to the change slowly over time therefore are unaffected . I would slowly drop it down though to where you need it , and i am not sure if this is the culprit or not just my thoughts , i am sure someone with a better understanding will chime in.

sorry to hear this bad news and good luck figuring it out.

Good Point

[HUNGER]

ya dont see that killing ur fish but it mite

[Joel]

If it's only been the fish added recently that have died and the old timers are all fine, I'd also wonder about the quality of these newer fish.

Might not be something you've done wrong or something wrong with your tank, it may be there was something wrong with the fish before you even got them.

[HUNGER]

very true joel good point

[JP2006]

If it's only been the fish added recently that have died and the old timers are all fine, I'd also wonder about the quality of these newer fish.

Might not be something you've done wrong or something wrong with your tank, it may be there was something wrong with the fish before you even got them.

That is a good point. It is important to know where the fish came from. Some places the fish are collected in questionable methods, which lead to a short life.  When I say "where they came from" I dont mean the vendor, as much as geographically, australia, fiji, etc.

[Joel]

That is a good point. It is important to know where the fish came from. Some places the fish are collected in questionable methods, which lead to a short life.  When I say "where they came from" I dont mean the vendor, as much as geographically, australia, fiji, etc.

I do agree but lets not lay all the blame on the collector or importer.

Perfectly healthy fish are doomed if they are put into the hands of a retailer that does not  practice good livestock husbandry.  Just as important as who they (the retailer) bought their fish from, what they do with the live stock once in their possession is very important. There is a lot more to it than space practically allows here but in a nut shell, not all fish need the same thing once they arrive at a store from a wholesaler or importer. And there are numerous situations that will determine specifically what a fish should have done to it. Also, very few shops isolate or quarantine their fish prior to selling nor do many hobbyist before putting into their aquarium. Another this is that some shops holding systems are pretty bad. Poor water quality, unstable conditions and excessive use of "chemicals" or un necessary use of medications can all be harmful. Some rely on adding products to the water thinking it aids or fixes stressful conditions. None of these are a good situation.

Another point that was touched on earlier is that just like in an aquarium shop, what the hobbyist does to a fish when they get it home and how they have been maintaining the aquarium can play a roll in this. Improper acclimation can weaken and kill a fish or lead up to it's death in the near future, I think most understand that.  But, another scinario that I have seen is the customer that kills just about everything they buy but the fish they already had in their tank are fine and don't die. (obviously they blame it on the aquarium shop and their poor quality fish) I can't tell you how many times I have heard, "well, all my other fish are fine!". If a person is  doing something (or not doing something) to their aquarium that generates an un natural or unhealthy environment, it is highly likely it took them weeks or even months to get their aquarium into this condition. That being said, the existing live stock in their aquarium has had a long time getting adjusted to that environment. A new fish is acclimated typically in and hour or two ( or often less) and is forced into what could be a very different environment than where they came from. This is not limited to PH, ammonia Nitrite, nitrate or phosphate issues. Persons who "chemically" alter thier aquarium often experience a similar problem. This is especially true with persons who supplement their aquarium and either don't test properly (or at all) or are just kind of "winging it" with supplements and test infrequently. (weekly or less)

I don't know that any of these scenario are what Larry is experiencing. These are just situations that I have seen in the past being offered as possible causes.

Joel

[jungliztkruger]

could this have anything to do with the kalwasser water change water?

[ghurlag]

All solid points, Joel.

I think it's important to remember in this case that Larry himself hasn't pinned the blame elsewhere; rather he is tickling our collective brain to learn from this experience in hopes that he doesn't have a repeat performance.  The worst part of losing fish is when they appear to be perfectly healthy, and then, overnight, go belly up.  I have had phantom water quality issues plague freshwater over my years in the hobby.  Sometimes it just happens with no discernible rhyme or reason.  

[larrynews]

i have had great luck in the past with this place, so who knows sometimes i make mistakes, yes hard to believe, so not sure maybe a little of everything. thanks to all

[jungliztkruger]

I had some chromis' die in my ten 2 seperate times. They looked healthy and ate like champs... I think I was mixing my kalk topoff too strong and lowered it and the third is doing good. Maybe the little change a few weeks ago did em in?

[Reefd Up]

I really have to back up here and ask some more *basic* questions.

Overall, there are no red flags flown, but I think we're missing more of the picture.  Just salinity should not kill new fish.  Large salinity differences could cause stress problems in the fish, but these problems would likely be noticable.  For instance, if the place you received the fish from was doing a hypo-salinity treatment...and you were running on the high side of normal (in the scientific community, >5 x natural seawater is considered "hyper-salinity"), the difference could cause stress. 

What are your other chemicals testing at?  Ammonia, Nitrite, Nitrate, Phosphates, pH, temp, etc?  Did you test the salinity, pH, or temp of the water when you received the fish?  How did you acclimate?  Did you treat the fish for anything? 

We also need to look at what type of fish they were and if they were being fed the proper foods.  What did you feed them in the few days they were eating? 

How did you notice the fish were dead?  Did you find them being eaten in the corner of the tank by a clean-up crew, were they floating, or did they just disappear over night?  Prior to their death, did they exhibit any signs of stress or illness?  Trouble breathing?