Author Topic: vodka dosing (Read 8625 times)

verper · « **Reply #25 on:** November 13, 2008, 21:24:00 »

Quote from: Amstar on November 13, 2008, 20:11:57

doesnt gfo help reduce the same things that vodka dosing is trying to do?

The GFO does remove PO4 (phosphates) but does nothing for NO3 (nitrates). I used GFO from the beginning on my tank. The weird part was that I always had low levels of PO4 or NO3. But I did have plenty of bubble algae and some turf algae. My conclusion was that the bubble algae was using what ever amounts I had in the tank. Somehow the VSV dosing build up enough bacterial in the tank to out compete the algae.

Amstar · « **Reply #26 on:** November 13, 2008, 21:37:29 »

I wouldnt think that with a tank only 6 months old that vodka dosing would be the way to go?

has to be something contributing to the red-slime and algae??

or I may just be missing something here

rmstevensiii · « **Reply #27 on:** November 14, 2008, 00:46:07 »

Jeff,

It's your tank, and it's your call, but I'd proceed very cautiously from here. You can temporarily clean out the red slime algae that you are seeing by blowing it lose with a turkey baster, and removing it from the tank. If it were my system, I'd hold off on the vodka dosing, and try and address the source. Cheap vodka is not good for anything or anyone, and it could do more harm than good.

A 6 month old system is pretty new. As previously stated, it can take more than a yr for your tank to truly mature. It is very possible that your system is going thru a mini cycle, esp if you are in and out of the tank often.

What is your water source? How old are your bulbs? Also keep in mind, that some algae will always exist in most systems. There are several reefers posting here, with very mature systems, and excellent tank maintenance routines, who still have some algae from time to time. In nature, there is, and will always be, a balance.

If it were me, I'd try to identify and address the root cause, remove what I could, and be very, very patient. If you are doing your part (not overfeeding, skimming, keeping up on water changes, using an appropriate, quality bulb and replacing then on schedule, have a good maintenance plan, etc), the tank will mature, and it will find its balance.

When that happens, you get to sit back, enjoy it, drink the vodka (or another beverage of your choice), and try not to screw it up!

My .02

apelaston · « **Reply #28 on:** November 14, 2008, 00:59:50 »

I have been very lucky n since i put my tank up in april haue never had an issue w algea. . .i do not think i am in the clear though. . .i agree that our systems are just babies and have some more maturing to do b4 we start giving it vodka sugar shots. . i would try to get to the root as well.

JoeAyers · « **Reply #29 on:** November 14, 2008, 08:43:48 »

I've thought about this in the past and thought I would maybe give my opinion (No scientific fact, but I did sleep at a Holiday Inn Express last night). The whole goal of setting up a new tank with live rock and moving very slowly is to have the bacteria build up to handle the bio-load, to cycle the tank. What's wrong with helping it along with a little Stoli? We are just adding more bacteria types and thus cycling the tank faster. I would take it very Very veeerrrrryy slow but I wouldn't shy away if you are willing to make the commitment. In a new tank (assuming it isn't full of corals yet) the worst thing I could see happening is an algae outbreak from over dosing. Now I could be completely wrong and I won't be putting vodka in my new tank any time soon as I actually enjoy watching the tank work through all the cycles, but I'm not 100% sure it's a bad idea.

CoralBeauties · « **Reply #30 on:** November 25, 2008, 21:09:46 »

I am starting on my 12th day of dosing. Started out with just .1ml per 20 gallons. I slowly worked up my way to the dose of .5ml now. Things that I have noticed so far. Within the last several days I have noticed that my millis which have never shown signs of coralites are now forming them starting from the tips very slowly working their way down each branch. I have noticed a slight decrease in the purple coloration in one of my tricolors and the purple rimmed cap. Not sure if it is from the vsv or a bulb change I did several weeks before I started this. All the other corals are unchanged in both color and polyp extension. Tonight I have noticed that the green mat type of algae that has been on my rock work has started to turn white. so far so good, no adverse effects.
When should I start adding the aminos?
Jeff

MSUJenn · « **Reply #31 on:** November 25, 2008, 21:46:08 »

That's great that you're seeing positive results Jeff. The color loss could be from the vsv. Mine turned pale until I started the AA's and feeding more. What are your phosphate and nitrate readings (can't remember if you said they were already zero). You could probably start adding the AA's now, but I'd keep an eye on the algae, and back off the aminos if it starts growing more. I would probably keep your vsv dose where it is, and not increase it anymore, since you're seeing results. You don't want to get a bacterial bloom.

Jon in SW Ohio · « **Reply #32 on:** November 26, 2008, 15:17:10 »

I'm finally taking the plunge and starting to dose vodka today.

My tank is over 2 years old, and has had a caulerpa problem since I first realized what the "plant" on my one piece of live rock really was. I run a Reef Octopus BH-100 skimmer and have for well over a year. I also keep chaeto in all 3 back chambers of the tank (it's a 12g AquaPod). I do weekly 10-20% waterchanges and all my tests show undetectable levels of ammonia, nitrite, nitrate and phosphate and have for a loooooong time (I test weekly). Still I have bubble algae and turf algae growing amongst the caulerpa.

The tank is currently only LPS and zoas/palys, with one small frag of the Sunset Montipora since all my SPS were wiped out after the great power outage of '08.

I plan on dosing .05mL of vodka a day since I have roughly 10 gallons of water in the system. The corals I plan on spot feeding as usual, and eventually dosing aminos.

Fingers crossed!

Charlie · « **Reply #33 on:** November 27, 2008, 10:12:07 »

How do you guys deal with the low O2 and how do you address low phosphate levels? I know someone is going to say low phosphate levels???- duh. Most hobby grade test kits will not read low phosphate levels. How do you determin when you have reached your "maintenance" dose? I have contemplated using the voda method myself but I would have to agree with Joe here. I think I have dealt with just about everything coming and going. I currently have cayno that just will not go away (just enough to be annoying) and right now I am dealing with dinos. I just don't believe there are any quick fixes in this hobby. Hopefully some type of carbon dosing will show some type of positive results long term in the future but so far research has not shown this to be so. This dino outbreak is really trying my patience. I may try carbon dosing short term but am still on the fence. I already have a CO2 issue in my house and really do not need to complicate things.

apelaston · « **Reply #34 on:** December 23, 2008, 01:28:07 »

Any updates on how ur guys dosing is going?

Charlie · « **Reply #35 on:** December 23, 2008, 10:16:42 »

I was kinda wondering the same thing. I posted a few questions almost a month ago and never got a response.

Jon in SW Ohio · « **Reply #36 on:** December 23, 2008, 14:47:57 »

This is definitely not a quick fix...

I'm still dosing daily, and the main thing I've noticed is the Caulerpa isn't noticeably growing. It's still alive and green where it's at, just no new growth stolons what so ever. Bubble algae has declined a bit as well, but probably only by around 20%. Cyano is minimal, but still on the couple exposed parts of my big Acan from Hurricane Ike power outage damage. I have to scrub the tank glass around once a week or so, but that's still the same as always. The skimmer pulls out a little bit more than it was before, but there's also now 4 full grown Mexican Turbo Snails adding to the bioload.

It's hard to say if the vodka is what's limiting Caulerpa growth though since I've still got my share of Asparagopsis in the tank. The last time I had an Asparagopsis outbreak, it out competed the Caulerpa too. It can thrive in newly mixed saltwater so I'm guessing it isn't too picky about low nutrients. There is ONE quick fix to Asparagopsis thankfully and I'm in the middle of it...Mexican Turbo Snails. In two weeks, 80% of it is gone so now I can soon see if the vodka or Asparagopsis is what's limiting the Caulerpas growth.

I only have one SPS and it's a Sunset Monti. No changes in color so can't testify to color enhancing effects...just thankful the snails haven't bulldozed it onto an Acan or Micromussa yet.

Low 02 has never been a problem for me and still isn't...though I guess I have my fair share of "marine plants" oxygenating the water LOL

As for phosphates, I've yet to find a test kit that can measure my levels so can't comment there.

To sum it up, I've seen zero negative effects and the algae doesn't seem to rebound as quickly so I'm sticking with it. I probably need to up my dose soon but am taking it slow and steady for now. $4.00 bought me enough 80 proof vodka to last a year or more...minus what the girls take out for White Russians, so I'll at least dose that long.

Charlie · « **Reply #37 on:** December 23, 2008, 16:58:01 »

Nice update Jon. From everything I have read vodka dosing will not effect the cyano.

CoralBeauties · « **Reply #38 on:** December 23, 2008, 18:30:23 »

I have had my dose level at 1.5ml per 20 gallons of water. I havent seen really any decrease of red algae growth. Algae growth on the glass has decreased. I dont have the same polyp extension with my sps as before the vsv. especially with my millis. I started to dose aminos at 3ml for a 220 gallon system and noticed some of my acros actually loosing colors. I quite them and continued with the vsv. I have just decided to stop dosing and see what happens with the sps extension. Right now I dont feel the little gain that I have seen is worth the loss of my sps's polyps extension. I have since added 6 mangroves into my sand bed in my sump and hope over time they will help. I can live with what algae that I have but if I ever get a blow out of bubble algae I will probably try this again. My old tank had tons of bubble and I hated it with a passion.
Jeff

aquavista99 · « **Reply #39 on:** December 23, 2008, 20:12:48 »

Quote from: jjoos99 on December 23, 2008, 18:30:23

I have had my dose level at 1.5ml per 20 gallons of water. I havent seen really any decrease of red algae growth. Algae growth on the glass has decreased. I dont have the same polyp extension with my sps as before the vsv. especially with my millis. I started to dose aminos at 3ml for a 220 gallon system and noticed some of my acros actually loosing colors. I quite them and continued with the vsv. I have just decided to stop dosing and see what happens with the sps extension.

Jeff, is your red algae problem red turf algae or red slim algae? If it is red turf algae, which will thrive in SPS conditions, then your problem can be solved by adding mexican turbo snails. I rarely see bubble algae on wild reefs, but I have yet to find a natural cure to eliminate them in home aquariums. Emerald crabs did not work for me.

MSUJenn · « **Reply #40 on:** December 23, 2008, 21:23:24 »

That's a bummer Jeff. I'm sorry to hear about that. Atleast you were able to realize it and stop dosing before things got worse.

Charlie- I sent you a very long pm

.

yinyang · « **Reply #41 on:** December 24, 2008, 00:06:24 »

hey!!
aquavista99
try spider crab
i have some rock have bubble on it
the spider crab get rid all for me( he pop them then eat but i don't have the outbreak

)
for other hair algae i use turbo snail & kole tang it works wonder
red slimer algae use sand shifter star fish

CoralBeauties · « **Reply #42 on:** December 24, 2008, 06:12:57 »

I have the red slime. it is just a few areas here and there. Verper mentioned that it might be an imbalance within the tank but i didnt get a good chance to ask him about it. Too busy moving a 300 gallon tank at the time

I am not totally sure it is the vsv that is causing the reduced polyp extension. I should find out soon as the vsv works it's way out of the system.
Jeff

lazylivin · « **Reply #43 on:** December 24, 2008, 12:45:09 »

Quote from: yinyang on December 24, 2008, 00:06:24

hey!!
aquavista99
try spider crab
i have some rock have bubble on it
the spider crab get rid all for me( he pop them then eat but i don't have the outbreak )

One of these Giant Spider Crabs should do the trick

The funny thing is it would probably actually fit in your tank. Then after bubble algae is gone you could eat it!

yinyang · « **Reply #44 on:** December 24, 2008, 13:22:30 »

lol!!
i don't think he will only eat bubble algae

apelaston · « **Reply #45 on:** December 25, 2008, 00:07:23 »

Is that crab 4real. . . .wow. . . . .

MechanicalEngineer · « **Reply #46 on:** December 25, 2008, 00:18:19 »

Looks similar to my Christmas dinner tomorrow!

aquavista99 · « **Reply #47 on:** February 24, 2009, 15:24:15 »

Quote from: verper on November 08, 2008, 10:36:26

Yes. It worked beautifully for me but at some cost. I used the Prodibio Bio Digest and the Vodka/sugar/vinegar (VSV) method. If you have been reading about it, then you know you need a big skimmer for it to work well. You may have some red slime at first, but it goes away. I did.

Scott, do you have any good links you can post about the Prodibio Bio Digest and the Vodka/sugar/vinegar method to share? I manually removed 99% of the bubble algae in my system with the new tank move but I know it will come back unless I give VSV a try.

JoeAyers · « **Reply #48 on:** February 24, 2009, 16:07:22 »

Quote from: aquavista99 on February 24, 2009, 15:24:15

Scott, do you have any good links you can post about the Prodibio Bio Digest and the Vodka/sugar/vinegar method to share? I manually removed 99% of the bubble algae in my system with the new tank move but I know it will come back unless I give VSV a try.

Tim,

Be careful with the VSV/Biodigest. You already have an ultra clean system and VSV will just increase that. Usually you have to start feeding heavily at some point. Corals can only handle so much clean water or the will bleach.

http://glassbox-design.com/2008/vsv-total-organic-carbon-in-the-reef-aquarium/

http://glassbox-design.com/2008/the-vsv-method-faq/
Joe

verper · « **Reply #49 on:** February 24, 2009, 16:47:02 »

Tim,

I agree with Joe. You run a very clean system to begin with so just be very careful and start slowly. You will also have a hard time determining when you are at a Ultra Low Nutrient System level without glass. The glass will remain clean for up to 10 days without needing cleaned in a ULNS system. If you're treating your rubbermaid tub, it will be hard to determine when to cut the dosing back to maintainence levels. It will work on the bubble aglae.

Joe posted the main links. Another good link:

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1449361&perpage=25&pagenumber=1

2024 Ohio Reef Frag Swap

Author Topic: vodka dosing (Read 8625 times)

apelaston

Charlie

apelaston

Charlie

Charlie

apelaston

MechanicalEngineer