Author Topic: Kenn inspired Algae Turf Scrubber Discussion (Read 9317 times)

DarinSchmidt · « **on:** May 10, 2011, 15:00:20 »

Some of you may not knwo what an algae scrubber is, or if you do, wonder what my obsession is with it. It's about 10til i leave from work so i'll prob have to finish this when i get home.

I like my algae scubber because of several reasons.

1. It uses less energy than a skimmer
2. Its less bulky (personal likeness)
3. I dont have to worry about microbubbles
4. I can use it as a food source for fish and other critters
5. no worries about overfilling the skimmer cup or fluxuations in water leves. (I've had my skimmer just start pooring in clean water into the cup and over fill. Always had to mess with the water level adjustment in my $180 skimmer form the LFS)
6. It cleans out Ammonia, P04, Nitrates and Nitrites
7. Helps balance PH levels at night
8. Can use it to fertilize your flowers, garden, etc.
9. It costs me about 50 bucks in modifications to set it up
10. I have gone months without water changes because it keeps the balance in the tank

theres more, but i got to leave.

Kenn · « **Reply #1 on:** May 10, 2011, 15:15:07 »

Thank you for the honorable mention

This will be a great post

Myreef55 · « **Reply #2 on:** May 10, 2011, 15:39:56 »

Is there a build thread on these?

DarinSchmidt · « **Reply #3 on:** May 10, 2011, 15:46:00 »

Give me a couple hours and ill explain everything.

Viggen · « **Reply #4 on:** May 10, 2011, 16:20:26 »

it is a nice alternative for filtration..... or just doing a algae filter, a cheaper/simpler version which also produces food

If I recall one of the tanks at the Newport Aquarium uses a Turf Scrubber

Boonjob · « **Reply #5 on:** May 10, 2011, 17:07:27 »

ROFL, amazing name

I set mine up last night and it cost me less than 50.00 and that was including the pump. I will try to post some pics of mine as it progresses from new to mature

DarinSchmidt · « **Reply #6 on:** May 10, 2011, 17:49:41 »

here are the pics of mine with the cheato in the refuge. It runs off the drain/return pipe 1.5". slip on coupler and a slip on end cap for easy removal for cleaning. Its held in the tube using zipties. the slit is a little over 1/8" wide all the way to one end to slip the screen out. Gets about 35-40gph flow per inch across. The screen needs to be 2 1sq" of screen per gallon. Oversize it for flexibility for more fish later on. Mine is sized for 380 gallons and i have a total water volume of about 350. My screen is pretty clean since it was out of water while i was building my new tank. I have 4 23w CFL 2700k bulbs lighting it.

Boonjob · « **Reply #7 on:** May 10, 2011, 18:03:26 »

After seeing yours I am going to make some mods to mine tonight... I glued mine altogether and cut a slit in the pipe but I didnt cut the slit starting from the end to allow the sheet to slide out mine pushes up into the pipe and then I affix the zip ties to hold it on on the outside the pipe... I like the idea of having it all internal and being able to completely disassemble for cleaning as I only left one end open to slip a pipe brush through... thx for the pics

Myreef55 · « **Reply #8 on:** May 11, 2011, 09:27:26 »

Where did you get the screen material?

DarinSchmidt · « **Reply #9 on:** May 11, 2011, 12:20:42 »

Hobby Loby. Its the crochet plastic screen. You have to seriously rough upthe screen so the algae will hold onto the screen

Kenn · « **Reply #10 on:** May 11, 2011, 13:31:14 »

Great post Darin

Myreef55 · « **Reply #11 on:** May 11, 2011, 13:36:39 »

You just use sand paper to rough it up?

DarinSchmidt · « **Reply #12 on:** May 11, 2011, 14:08:01 »

actually, i used a jig saw blade. I'll take a pic of the contraption i made and post it. it helped make it a lot easier. You need something jagged to run over the screen that will make gashes. I tried some 80 and 40 grit sand paper, didnt do so well. The jigsaw blade did the best.

Kenn · « **Reply #13 on:** May 11, 2011, 14:57:03 »

When you mention you have gone months with out a water change I presume that you are using supplemental additives?

DarinSchmidt · « **Reply #14 on:** May 11, 2011, 15:14:51 »

Yeah. I dose alk and calc and mag

DarinSchmidt · « **Reply #15 on:** May 11, 2011, 18:32:29 »

here is the tool that i made to rough up the screen

i made an acrylic case for it to prevent splatters since my screen doesnt touch the surface of the water below. I left the one side open so that it's still easy to remove for cleaning.

lazylivin · « **Reply #16 on:** May 11, 2011, 20:20:42 »

The acrylic case is going to get splatters and salt creep significantly cutting down light. Consider having the screen extend down into the water and then you wouldn't need the acrylic case and would be getting much more light on the algae, better growth or could use less wattage lamps to reduce energy consumption.

DarinSchmidt · « **Reply #17 on:** May 11, 2011, 20:29:22 »

it hardly gets any splatters on the side walls. mainly from underneath where the light doesnt matter so much. I'll keep an eye on how much salt builds up on the sides, it might not be so bad as to clean it with a bottle brush once every couple weeks to a month. I'll keep you posted on how it does. I agree that it will block some light, but i already have 23w (100w equivalent) CFLs on there which is more than enough. I'll keep track of its effectiveness and let you know. If within a month i find it troublesome, i may remove it.

Though, like you said, making the screens longer may solve all my problems and the screens are less than 2 bucks each.... hmmmm.... I'll see how well this works out.

harleyrider · « **Reply #18 on:** May 11, 2011, 20:55:43 »

Even if there is no splatter, your going to build up salt creep rather quickly do to evaporation of your water most of you salinity stays in the water but you still have some that rises up and out of your tank ,you want as much of your light as possible on it. and you will want to clean it at least once weekly if set up and producing right, if you dont it stinks very quickly, and will spread through your system. and beleive me that sucks!!

DarinSchmidt · « **Reply #19 on:** May 11, 2011, 20:59:15 »

lol, like i said, i'll keep an eye on it and if it becomes a problem i'll extend the screen

Cole Harlow · « **Reply #20 on:** May 13, 2011, 07:33:21 »

would it be possible to use red leds to grow the algae insted of metal halides

DarinSchmidt · « **Reply #21 on:** May 13, 2011, 09:25:11 »

Leds are still experimental so I can't say if it works well or not

Reefpete · « **Reply #22 on:** May 13, 2011, 10:58:23 »

The wheels are turning already for my next filtration set up w a ATF! Thanks for the post!

Boonjob · « **Reply #23 on:** May 13, 2011, 22:50:47 »

I can not for the life of me get the water to run down evenly on both sides(front and back) of the sheet... is it ok to have the water running down primarily one side? it's only 5" wide and I am throwing 230gph at it, so it has plenty of flow and the slit was 1/8" but that just caused it to spray everywhere so I widened it quite a but but the water still refuses to flow on both sides

Kenn · « **Reply #24 on:** May 13, 2011, 22:58:56 »

Quote from: Boonjob on May 13, 2011, 22:50:47

I can not for the life of me get the water to run down evenly on both sides(front and back) of the sheet... is it ok to have the water running down primarily one side? it's only 5" wide and I am throwing 230gph at it, so it has plenty of flow and the slit was 1/8" but that just caused it to spray everywhere so I widened it quite a but but the water still refuses to flow on both sides

What about droping the far side of the pipe a 1/4"or so ??

DarinSchmidt · « **Reply #25 on:** May 13, 2011, 23:00:52 »

The water in mine doesn't exactly flow 50/50. If you can turn your tube you can cause water to flow on one side more than the other and tweak it to flow as close to 50/50. That's why I didn't glue that coupler to the drain. As long as its getting good flow, shouldn't really be a major issue but I would tweak it to be as close to 50/50. Can you post some pics?

Boonjob · « **Reply #26 on:** May 13, 2011, 23:21:55 »

Yeah I'll get some pics up in a sec...Mine isn't even 50/50 it's more like 90/10 at best

DarinSchmidt · « **Reply #27 on:** May 13, 2011, 23:50:52 »

Quote from: Lazylivin on May 11, 2011, 20:20:42

The acrylic case is going to get splatters and salt creep significantly cutting down light. Consider having the screen extend down into the water and then you wouldn't need the acrylic case and would be getting much more light on the algae, better growth or could use less wattage lamps to reduce energy consumption.

I'll be getting some new screen this week. The splatters for the first day were only on the underside and now have gone on the sides of the walls i made. So there isnt much i can do about the side splatters but that would be a huge contributor to salt creep. Plus with the longer screen (nothing wrong with oversizing) it will make it quieter, not that it's loud, kind of like a small fountain. So while i'm in dayton on sunday i'll stop at hoby loby and pick up a couple screens.

Boonjob · « **Reply #28 on:** May 14, 2011, 00:20:14 »

Thats with it hooked up to my phosban reactor(just cause the pump for the scrubber is mixing salt atm since it was down for mods)

The phosban can go up to 200gph not sure what it was running in that pick but it was wide open. but I yield almost the exact same results with the normal pump just slightly stronger flow on the one side

DarinSchmidt · « **Reply #29 on:** May 14, 2011, 00:49:56 »

The CFL's you are using are Daylight 6500k ones, i used those for a while, they dont do all that well, it takes forever for the algae to grow with that light, the 2700k warm whites do better, just a little tip.

I think i ran into this before. The PVC is so thick and the cut you make into it has to either be straight, or cut into a V to balance out any variation because the pressure of the water coming out will go in the direction of the slit of the pipe. It has enough thickness to push the water to one side. I always slant the inside a little since its near impossible to cut perfectly straight.

Boonjob · « **Reply #30 on:** May 14, 2011, 02:47:28 »

Hmmm... thanks for the info on the light... I figured a cooler light would produce certain unwanted algae.. I know my cheato is growing like a weed with it; I had a softball sized piece just a week ago and it has easily tripled in size. I had the soft whites in there to begin with I will just swap em out...

I'll have to try putting the cut on a slant...

DarinSchmidt · « **Reply #31 on:** May 14, 2011, 02:52:30 »

I too started out with cool white lights because I had them on hand but it doesn't grow the long hair algae that you'll want growing to filter your tank. It moreso grown the short compact algae that can cause problems (die off mostly)

DarinSchmidt · « **Reply #32 on:** May 15, 2011, 09:21:30 »

any update Boon?

Boonjob · « **Reply #33 on:** May 15, 2011, 13:59:09 »

I v'd the cut as instructed... and it did increase the flow but I still can't get a 50/50 mix... I'm just gonna let it go the way it is, and see if I get anything I would assume as the algae grows the friction will cause the excess water to go into spots with little to no algae growth and just cause those spots to grow...we shall see

Boonjob · « **Reply #34 on:** May 21, 2011, 00:21:50 »

So here is the progress after the ATS being functional for one full week, this is my first cleaning, just did it tonight.

Boonjob · « **Reply #35 on:** May 21, 2011, 00:29:23 »

Dt view of one week after cheato/scrubber combo has been added... Also performed 40gal W/C this past week and replaced the phosphate media. My flow is suffering atm due to a koralia going down(please disregard

)

DarinSchmidt · « **Reply #36 on:** May 21, 2011, 00:34:52 »

Lookin good

Boonjob · « **Reply #37 on:** May 21, 2011, 00:36:45 »

I think so, I'm currently very happy with it... best $$ I've spent on it yet imo...certainly the cheapest

lazylivin · « **Reply #38 on:** May 21, 2011, 09:55:30 »

Consider sliding your koralia down the side of your tank to about the 1/2 way point and point it toward the middle front of your glass. Position it horizontally or slightly up at about 10:00 position. It will get some circular motion going which will give much more even flow dispersed all around the tank. Once you get a replacement pump put it on the left side back of the tank pointing to the opposite side of the tank. This will exponentially increase flow. They would be working together creating a whirlpool and if positioned well it can even create a small vortex in center of the tank.

Boonjob · « **Reply #39 on:** May 21, 2011, 12:29:55 »

Good deal, I will have to do that

DarinSchmidt · « **Reply #40 on:** May 22, 2011, 20:54:29 »

here is my scrubber before my 4 day cleaning

when its dark like that, that means theres a lot of nutrients in the water and you have to get it cleaned off sooner than 1 week or else the underlying layers of algae will start to die off and pollute the water with the stuff you are trying to get out of it because the light cant penetrate it. Eventually, there will be the lighter hairier green algae that will grow massively, and its starting to happen, but you cant really see it in the image.

Boonjob · « **Reply #41 on:** May 22, 2011, 23:25:16 »

I bought some 2700k lights, Was wondering if switching out the 6700k with them is really gonna improve the growth? I seem to have a good start with the 6700k and though I don't mind putting on the 2700k, I don't want to start growing bad algae

DarinSchmidt · « **Reply #42 on:** May 23, 2011, 00:03:09 »

I started with 6500k and got descent growth. Never really developed growth longer than a centemeter. But it could have been due to underpowering with 60w bulbs. With 2700k, the algae grows really fast as it has more of the red spectrum. Many others have reported exceptional growth with 2700k compared yo any other.

Boonjob · « **Reply #43 on:** May 23, 2011, 00:05:08 »

Sounds good, I'll switch em out right now

thepipbull · « **Reply #44 on:** May 25, 2011, 05:42:17 »

Just thought I join the ATS gang. It has been up for 2 weeks and doing just fine.

running for 2 days

1 week

DarinSchmidt · « **Reply #45 on:** May 26, 2011, 21:44:11 »

Had to clean my screen. Should have prob done it a couple days ago. I cleaned it really good because that dark algae really cakes on and can be a little bit of a pita to get off. Again, another 4 days after my last cleaning, but it could have used it sooner as it looked to be about this way a couple days after cleaning....

put some tape on the end so the end cap wouldnt fall off

replaced my bulbs also, it's been close to 3 months and they were getting slightly dimmer. if you enlarge the this image you can see how clean it got it with my scrub brush. A few more weeks maybe and my scrubber should be getting back on track.

DarinSchmidt · « **Reply #46 on:** June 01, 2011, 20:44:54 »

made a slight modification. As you can see the light green algae is starting to take over. Thats the algae that you want. In the last image is the modification. I draped some clear plastic over the top to stop the splatter which is what the side walls were for. Until i get the larger screen from slandis, i had to put the base covers on to stop splatter from the bottom. Also in the end cap i put in a air line to help prevent the air from spurting water everywhere making noise and mess (pressure release). I tried running airline from the top but the water moves so fast that it just sucks the air down with it. So now its 10x quieter, no side walls to clean and obstruct the light, and i installed a bracket to hold up the tube to release any pressure wherever it may cause problems.

DarinSchmidt · « **Reply #47 on:** June 12, 2011, 09:13:20 »

Man, i cleaned my algae scrubber yesterday and you should see the algae growing off of it now. I was in such a hurry to get it cleaned that i forgot to take a picture..... I'll get a picture of it again in a week. Almost all the dark algae slime is gone and the nice healthy light green hair algae is taking over.

I should have cleaned it a few days ago but these past couple weeks have been really busy and algae started growing on my rocks because my skrubber wasnt able to do its job properly without a cleaning. should be back to normal within the month and the algae in the tank should be reduced back to normal within a couple weeks.

micki · « **Reply #48 on:** June 12, 2011, 09:14:45 »

Cool!

Wall_Tank · « **Reply #49 on:** June 12, 2011, 11:00:43 »

Quote from: DarinSchmidt on June 12, 2011, 09:13:20

I should have cleaned it a few days ago but these past couple weeks have been really busy and algae started growing on my rocks because my skrubber wasnt able to do its job properly without a cleaning. should be back to normal within the month and the algae in the tank should be reduced back to normal within a couple weeks.

Sounds like it is a cheap effective method, but Sounds like too much work for me.

DarinSchmidt · « **Reply #50 on:** June 12, 2011, 11:03:23 »

lol, its not a lot of work, you clean it once a week just like a skimmer

micki · « **Reply #51 on:** June 12, 2011, 11:09:06 »

Seriously considering doing this! Getting the goods from Mike in a few weeks!

DarinSchmidt · « **Reply #52 on:** December 04, 2011, 11:07:35 »

Well, i been reading up on some things over the past few months on RC and such. I feel pretty good today kowing that over a year ago i was correct with what i was doing compared to what they were telling me i was doing wrong at the time. But thats how advances are made, breakthroughs happen, etc.

The general "rule of thumb" (remember, i told you guys how much i dont liek to follow rule of thumbs for some things because it could be a simply dumbed down form for the "general" population that just wants something to work, not saying people are dumb, just some/most dont want to get technical with their equipment, etc). But my screens that i made for myself and several others have been, according to their standards, undersized and underpowered.

Well seems that a new revision was made and their new revision requires smaller screens than what i made and less power. lol, i actually oversized mine based on what i noticed with using the scrubber over the past ~2 years to handle what in the future could be a large bio-load.

Algae scrubbers in the begining were based off your display tank size, now they are being based on the bio-load, which is what i argued several months, almost a year ago, and was told "NO" and slapped on the hand for.

I'm done ranting how, just glad to see that the evolution of this is getting better and someone else prob got the credit for what i was arguing.

ohioreef · « **Reply #53 on:** December 04, 2011, 20:55:02 »

Does it have to be vertical with water flow on both sides?

I have an idea for one in my sump but it would be at an angle with water flowing down one side.

DarinSchmidt · « **Reply #54 on:** December 04, 2011, 21:05:02 »

If you do single sided it has to be twice as large, so yes if you want to do a horizontal you can

ohioreef · « **Reply #55 on:** December 04, 2011, 23:24:28 »

How much surface area is recommended for a 75g?

micki · « **Reply #56 on:** December 05, 2011, 06:58:48 »

Still interested in this, but not sure where we would put it! Sump, fuge are both full....

DarinSchmidt · « **Reply #57 on:** December 05, 2011, 11:31:48 »

theres room in the fuge room, trust me

micki · « **Reply #58 on:** December 05, 2011, 11:46:54 »

But where???

DarinSchmidt · « **Reply #59 on:** December 05, 2011, 11:49:38 »

i would have to take a look at the room again but theres a place for it, they dont take up much room.

micki · « **Reply #60 on:** December 05, 2011, 11:53:10 »

Ok, perhaps I should sign up to see if I can be one of your beta testers!

DarinSchmidt · « **Reply #61 on:** December 05, 2011, 11:57:47 »

2024 Ohio Reef Frag Swap

Author Topic: Kenn inspired Algae Turf Scrubber Discussion (Read 9317 times)