I believe I'll buy a sump

[~reefchik~]

I'm not going to build one, let's face it.  DH is too busy to even think of asking for help.  I don't know why it never occurred to me before to google SUMPS online. Duh.... 

So I did that today, and there are some interesting models out there.  I like some designs better than others.  If I'm going to do this, I may as well go whole-hog and do a refugium/sump anyway. 

Tomorrow I want to try and make a final decision.  I'll call around to the local guys and see if Marine Solutions or Justin carry something like that in stock, because cash & carry beats shipping any day.  Is there anyone else around here that might carry sumps?

If not, I still have a convo going with a local guy from this list who has something used that might still work.

The ones I like most are these (and opinions are welcomed:)
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=170368634492

http://www.aquariumguys.com/advance-series-sump.html

http://www.aquariumguys.com/bubble-less-reservoir.html

http://www.aquariumsupplycompany.com/catalog/item/3231887/2765116.htm  <<< now this one includes the skimmer, which probably isn't the best quality one, but still it seems like a good package. 

then there is the Lifereef guy but he doesn't publish his prices.  He's got some nice looking units, but I didn't have time to call him today to ask.  I'm guessing his are up there price-wise, though.

[Reefd Up]

First one...
I don't like how the water just flows straight across the middle section.  If you stick a DSB there, you're good...but if you stick macroalgae there, it won't get enough flow and waste exchange.

Second one...
Can't see enough of it to tell.

Third one...
You have some flexibility with that one.  I'd ditch the sponge and throw some rubble in there or something else.

Fourth one...
That skimmer probably isn't worth its weight in acrylic.  I think you'd be paying for a lot of unnecessary frills.

If I had to pick between the 4...I'd go with the 3rd and buy a separate skimmer.  Don't skimp on a good skimmer...it's not worth it later.  You may also want to check with Lonnie (Blown76Mav) and see if he would build you something better.

[jd]

Steph, I hate to see you spend so much on a sump! Making one is VERY easy. I did my first in about 2 hours, my second in about 30mins. Please consider building one yourself. I think you will be much happier with the results! If you don't have a caulk gun, the whole things might run you $50 bucks. $25 for the baffles, $10 for the caulk gun, $5 for the caulk, plus however much the tank will be. Check craig's list for some cheap tanks.

[harleyrider]

i was down at Marine Solutions this past weekend, they had a couple setting down there, depending on what room you have under the tank, i know its a 48 long but not for sure what your height is to put a good skimmer in you refuge, yours looks just like one i sold a while back, but may not be the same but i only had i beleive 22 inchs..

[~reefchik~]

JD, I'd need someone to cut pieces of glass or acrylic to measure, right?
I have silicone and I have a couple 10 gallon tanks in the basement not being used.  I could probably even use my current 20 gallon tank, but I was thinking it might be best to leave it as a QT tank. 

harleyrider, 48" will be too long.  This has to go inside a stock pine AGA stand.  My door openings are only 15" wide, the base is 17" front to back and the height to the bottom of the tank is about 24". 

Reef'd Up,  I keep hearing that about a skimmer.  Must be the voice of experience    I think I like #3 the best so far too.  Maybe Lonnie will respond to the thread, too. 

[jd]

Steph, Look at fifteen gallon tanks, they are 24x12x12. I think the Justin from Aqt. Spec. mentioned that your center brace can come off your stand. If that was the case, I'd look into getting a 20gallon long. I would go with glass baffles. I got mine from Lowes for about 4 bucks each. I use GE brand silicone '1', becareful that the silicone you do use doesn't have any anti-mold agents in it.

Edit: Even if it would be a hassle, Draining the tank down, sliding it away from the wall to install the sump is a better idea. I'm not a fan of cutting braces and such

[Reefd Up]

JD, I'd need someone to cut pieces of glass or acrylic to measure, right?
I have silicone and I have a couple 10 gallon tanks in the basement not being used.  I could probably even use my current 20 gallon tank, but I was thinking it might be best to leave it as a QT tank. 

Heh heh, you underestimate redneck engineering!  If you pick up the sheets of plexiglass (the smaller ones...they're like around a normal piece of paper size) for about $1.50 each at Lowe's...some silicone (I've always used the aquarium silicone)...and a 10g tank...that's all you need. 

The smaller sheets of plexiglass don't fit perfectly in, but you can silicone them in on a diagonal.  Yes, normally silicone doesn't adhere well with glass, but on a 10g sump, it's not a big deal b/c there's not enough pressure.  Don't believe me?  Come check out my 10g diagonal baffle sump that has been running for about 2+ years now.  So, for a whopping $20 you can have a sump that isn't exactly attractive...but works.  It'll take maybe an hour to make...24 hours+ to cure.  Oh, you'll need duct tape too.   

I did a similiar thing with a 20g tank...but cut the plexiglass with a carpet cutter (we have a saw now for it.)  There's too much pressure with a 20g...so the baffles leak pretty badly.  But, my 10g baffles are solid. 

[jd]

Nikki, I have heard (dangerous statment, I know) that because acrylic and glass adsorb different amounts of water and thus, swell at different rates that if acrylic baffles are too snug you can bust the seems in a tank. Maybe someone can put their two cents in on that matter. In any case, Acrylic sheets cut small and the gaps filled with silicone should be fine. Lowes cuts acrylic sheets also. I think its $.25 a cut. The cut glass for free.

[harleyrider]

a ten gallon refugium on a 90 gallon tank

[Reefd Up]

I never said it was the best idea...just said it works if she's in a pinch.  I didn't see in this thread that she was going to use it on a 90g tank (been gone for 2 weeks...so I haven't been reading a lot.)  She also said that she had a 10g tank she could use.  Just trying to be helpful.

JD, you're right...the acyrlic will flex more than the glass...faster.  That's why it has to be on a really small scale that the pressure isn't too much.  On a 10g done this way, yes, the acrylic will bend, but it'll hold. 

[~reefchik~]

Nikki, no problem.  Yes, it's a 90.  Not so much that I'm in a pinch, just trying to figure out the best solution.  20-30 gallon sump is more what I'm thinking. 

As for cutting braces    I can't imagine anyone having the nerve to cut away part of a wooden stand while the full tank is on top.  Sounds like a Darwin Award in the making to me 

I never heard that about acrylic and glass swelling at different rates.  That could be a problem. 

[UD Flyer]

Yes, I would ill advice taking any bracing off of your stand. It is possible to take the middle brace out as long as there is something bracing the cross members of the tank. It may work for some people, but 90 gallons plus sand and rock isn’t worth it falling through. The wooden upright may be stapled but it’s more structurally sound upright then being taken off, regardless if it’s stapled, screwed or nailed.

 Definitely a Darwin award nomination if it falls through.

There are some “kits” that I saw on ebay when I clicked on the links about that are already precut and all that needs to be done is siliconed in. It may be worth looking into, and much cheaper if you can use an existing tank.

[Aquatic Specialists]

You can bring in your old tank and I can drill it hear in the shop, cut your baffle plates, seal it up, with aquarium sealent, the whole nine yards. It is much cheaper to make your own as opposed to buying one....a lot cheaper. With some of the designs on the sumps out there...let's just say there is a lot of unnecessary parts and inefficiencies to them. As far as that center upright goes don't cut it out, just pop it loose long enough to get a tank in there and put it back. Think back to the old wrought iron stands, they work with no center support. I built enormous racks here in the shop, that contain 40+ aquariums, and the load is all in the corners. Either way you could always use a little ingenuity and make a temporary brace that would be out of your way and  hold it for a short period. A 2x4 notched and cut at angle would work fine. Either way I do have a couple of  sumps in house or I can make you one.

[harleyrider]

thanks udflyer, glad to see someone agrees with me about choppin up that stand, Reefchic, my advice to you is go as big as you can on that refuge that will work, ive got a 30 long on my 55g it gets me by but thats about it, infact im in the process of putting a 90g into service, and im putting a 55 gal refuge on it, if youd like to see my 30 refuge, your more than welcome to im not far from you, but you would see what im sayin about size just let me know

[harleyrider]

Duane & Justin, did you guys build your stands with 3/4 wood, probly not you probly used 2x4 or 2x6 which i agree with, but that 3/4 crap like they built that stand with, no way id take it out, i had that same stand and that center brace the one in the middle is also notched at top and bottom for support and to equalize.

[Aquatic Specialists]

I believe there is a big misconception on the removing of the center brace. I never said cut it, chop it, hack it to pieces, just simply use another temporary brace and remove the center, as to be out of the way, replace the center brace and then remove the temporary brace. By doing that at no time would there be a worry about lack of support.

[UD Flyer]

I never said cut it, chop it, hack it to pieces, just simply use another temporary brace and remove the center, as to be out of the way, replace the center brace and then remove the temporary brace.

Actually you said "Usually those pine built stands are just stapled together and that center upright is just for show and the doors. It really has no load bearing issues. The load is all in the corners. That board can be removed and replaced easily enough if you wanted to go with a larger sump. "

A temporary brace was not implied or mentioned.


Reefchik, the cheapest thing would let a fellow member help you assemble one. The easiest, with money not being that big of a factor would buy a prefab one. I actually built one in a 20 gallon long and only took about an hour to build and an day's wait time for the silicone to cure. If you do decide to build your own just make sure you buy acrylic or glass that is thick enough so that there is no bowing or failing of the baffles because of the waters pressure/weight.

heres a picture of one I just sold on here:

[rayviv]

I'm not going to build one, let's face it.  DH is too busy to even think of asking for help.  I don't know why it never occurred to me before to google SUMPS online. Duh....  

So I did that today, and there are some interesting models out there.  I like some designs better than others.  If I'm going to do this, I may as well go whole-hog and do a refugium/sump anyway.  

Tomorrow I want to try and make a final decision.  I'll call around to the local guys and see if Marine Solutions or Justin carry something like that in stock, because cash & carry beats shipping any day.  Is there anyone else around here that might carry sumps?

If not, I still have a convo going with a local guy from this list who has something used that might still work.

The ones I like most are these (and opinions are welcomed:)
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=170368634492

http://www.aquariumguys.com/advance-series-sump.html

http://www.aquariumguys.com/bubble-less-reservoir.html

http://www.aquariumsupplycompany.com/catalog/item/3231887/2765116.htm  <<< now this one includes the skimmer, which probably isn't the best quality one, but still it seems like a good package.  

then there is the Lifereef guy but he doesn't publish his prices.  He's got some nice looking units, but I didn't have time to call him today to ask.  I'm guessing his are up there price-wise, though.

This is one that you need to look at. I wish I could do this with mine

http://i245.photobucket.com/albums/gg46/lunatik_69/DSCN0322.jpg

[jungliztkruger]

blown76mav does great work... i have like the second sump he ever made and it performs great. it is worth your time to talk to him

[verper]

When Aquarium Adventures was open down in Mason they had all kinds of 4" AGA stands there for tanks all the way up to 150 gal - Some with and some without center braces.  They even had some that had a center brace in the front for the doors to close onto but no brace in the back.  Everything OVER 4' had center braces.  Using my woodworker eyes I can state that they were made using the cheapest materials and fasteners available. 1x4 PINE (not even a hardwood) and staples for most fasteners.  The only thing going for them was the miracle of gravity - they made sure the tank corners sat right over two 1x4 pine pieces fastened at a 90 degree angle.  Remember, these are the official AGA tank stands that are available to keep your tank warranty in good standing with them.  If you don't believe any of this, I think there is still an Aquarium Adventures open in Columbus.  Go take a look see.

That being said, I agree with Justin from Aquatic Specialists.  The two things a 4' or less stand must do is hold the weight of the tank on the corners and not rack.  Removing and replacing the brace will not cause a problem.  My own 120 gal stand that I build based on what I saw with the AGA stands has no center braces -although it is built with 1x oak (hardwood), glue, and pocket screws.  Its been up for 4 years and the tank is at least a few years older than that with no leaks.

[Aquatic Specialists]

Well I do apologize for not being specific enough. I will try to be a little more clear and descriptive next time. Thank you Scott for backing that up, it's very true.

[~reefchik~]

Rayviv, that is a nice setup, isn't it?  I like the mangroves.  I brought back some mangrove pods to Ohio years ago (before I knew it was illegal).  My mom had a house on the bay and there were piles of these things washed up on the sand/oyster bar at low tide by her house.







ETA:  I didn't know who I was replying to

[~reefchik~]

I'm paralyzed now!  Information overload.  Too many choices and not enough experience to make an informed decision.   
I also have PMs from a few members who have things they could sell me. 

All PMs have been answered, at any rate. 

[harleyrider]

your best bet is just use common since, it will all work out! Good luck!

[rayviv]

I'm paralyzed now!  Information overload.  Too many choices and not enough experience to make an informed decision.   
I also have PMs from a few members who have things they could sell me. 

All PMs have been answered, at any rate. 

If it is not a 'must hurry' job I would definatly take time and decide what is going to be the best option.

(I did not know it was illegal)