DIY LEDs - anybody using or want to use?

[rayk]

Looking at LEDs as a lighting source, with Cap and Trade on the horizion, in whichever form, will probably significantly increase electricty cost from coal-based suppliers (i.e the midwest). 

Anybody use LEDs for coral growth at all? 
Anybody ever built any of the LED DIY fixtures as described on Reefcentral? 
Anybody interested in building the LED DIY fixture (i.e. group buy on LEDs for cheaper prices)?

If I expand my tank, I may keep my MH but why add more MHs if the cost of electricity goes up, when LEDs are supposed to be so much more efficient.

Thanks,
Ray

[rayk]

Whoops, just realized I posted this in equipment instead of DIY.  Can an admin move it please? 

Also, was using the reefcentral power calculator, looks like my 400 W MH costs $8.27 per month to operate at current DP&L rates.  Adding minimum 2 more MHs, and a 25% increase in electricity costs, that would be about $30 per month for MH.  Even if I only save half, that would be $15 per month.  Also, I would eliminate the $10 per month for VHO actinics.  So $25 per month, less heat, less cost to change bulbs... may be a winner if they actually work, which folks on reefcentral seem to think they do.

[cyberwollf]

I did a ton a reaserch and drew up the circuit, but never pulled the trigger on the project. How big of a tank you want to light. It's reasonable for nano's. But, with tank size your price increases quick. You can hit mutiple 1000 real fast

[rayk]

Yep, I'm researching that now.....  the tank will be 8 ft long if I ever get it, and the problem seems to be the number of power supplies and buck-pucks I will need.  Perhaps my original MH plan will just have to work for now, as I can't blow out my cost estimate for the wifey will get nervous...  well, more nervous...

- Rayk

[jd]

I think we are still a little ways away from LED's being common. Even in big group buys they still cost nearly $5 each. For an 8' tank you'd need a ton just to run the lengh. What are your planned dimensions? I'm thinking of building an 8 footer also

[slandis3]

Whoops, just realized I posted this in equipment instead of DIY.  Can an admin move it please? 

Done   

[harleyrider]

Dont mean to butt in, but ive been researching led's for some time now, and from what ive read from other people that have them they are simply fantastic, solaris has some good facts on them, with all the different rating, i have been trickin around with them for quite some time and are very impressed with what i have seen...Alot of the other forums on the net also have some pretty good facts on them too!

[Blown76mav]

I think we are still a little ways away from LED's being common. Even in big group buys they still cost nearly $5 each. For an 8' tank you'd need a ton just to run the lengh. What are your planned dimensions? I'm thinking of building an 8 footer also

What kind are you looking at?  LED's are usually less than 1$ each

[slandis3]

creed ( sp? ) leds are what you need they are still up there in price.

[Wall_Tank]

http://ledsupply.com/creexre.php

Cree Stars.  These are already mounted on a plate for easy attachment to a heat sink.

If I do one it'll be for my frag tank first......smaller size needed.

[Blown76mav]

Wow!!!!!  WAYYYY to much.  Check this out....

http://mcmelectronics.com/product/NTE-ELECTRONICS-NTE30045-/NTE30045

1.89 each and 1.69 each/100

Yep you have to mount them but LED's don't need a heat sink.

[slandis3]

the cree leds are what the Solaris fixtures use. A standard led will not perform as well. There is a huge write up on reef central about the difference between the 2.

[harleyrider]

ive been getting the same thing but without the heat sink, anywhere from .89 to 1.75ish other than the heat sink all the specs the same

[Blown76mav]

Don't want to start an internet war but the ones your looking at are 107 lumens (not very bright)   I've found White LED's 360,000 Lumens for 64$ for 50.  Thats only 1.28 each.  I would think we would want bright LED's for lighting.  Now if your just doing moon lights then the 107 lumen is fine.  But to light a tank I don't think they will work.

http://cgi.ebay.com/50p-H-P-Super-Bright-1W-10mm-WHITE-LED-LAMP-360-000mcd_W0QQitemZ370160981309QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item562f50553d&_trksid=p4634.c0.m14.l1262&_trkparms=|293%3A1|294%3A30

[harleyrider]

Do some research with (Lamp Elves) out of California, i do beleive you will be quite surprized!!

[harleyrider]

your right Blown,,, the ones i get, the blue (atinic) is 528 nm,

[Wall_Tank]

Don't want to start an internet war but the ones your looking at are 107 lumens (not very bright)   I've found White LED's 360,000 Lumens for 64$ for 50.  

those are 360,000 mcd's    not lumens.  These could be bright, but it depends on the lens angle.    If it is the typical 15-20 degree lens angle, it's probably only about 40-50 lumens

Granted the Cree Stars are probably overpriced due to the hype. 

If your buying the Cree emiters not mounted, becareful to read the surface mount criteria.  Surface mount soldering is quite a tricky science.

[Blown76mav]

those are 360,000 mcd's    not lumens.  These could be bright, but it depends on the lens angle.    If it is the typical 15-20 degree lens angle, it's probably only about 40-50 lumens

Granted the Cree Stars are probably overpriced due to the hype.  

If your buying the Cree emiters not mounted, becareful to read the surface mount criteria.  Surface mount soldering is quite a tricky science.

I know the difference between lumes and MCD's  its 360000 MCD ( I missedtyped)  = 172 lumens  which is brighter than the 107 for 3 times the cost.  The angle is 45* BTW

heres a conversion link for ya.

http://led.linear1.org/lumen.wiz

[TechGuy]

You guys need to quit worrying about Lumens or MCD of these LED's and look at the Par rating. If you guys are serious, you need to google "Lumens Vs Par". Then find someone with a PAR meter (if you can), start buying LEDS, and measure. Once you have some solid readings, post back. I would love for someone to come up with a PAR rating for different brand/wavelength LED's.

Lots of trial and error getting the colors the way you want. Because Lumens/MCD does not equal PAR. I think you will find it quite difficult to find the right combo of colors, to meet your required PAR, and Lumens for each color to balance.

Hence the reason prebuilt fixtures are so expensive, and come in small sizes.

Supplementing your reef with different colors of LED is a cool way to bring out certain colors, and something I will be experimenting with. But I will still need my good old T-5's, and Halides for the Photosynthetic radiation.

Plus, your worried about saving money. In the long run how much have you saved? How much energy is this fixture going to consume VS Halides VS the start up cost (labor + parts + research). After a bit of time with the PAR meter, I think you will find the required LED's are expensive. More than its worth.

But, by all means. Give this a shot. Point light sources make a reef look so much cooler with the shimmer. LED's are cool to begin with. Like I said, I want someone to post a scientific result of PAR for each LED.

[slandis3]

Here is the link from RC.   http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1587273&perpage=25&pagenumber=1

[TechGuy]

Here is the link from RC.   http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1587273&perpage=25&pagenumber=1

There you have it

Those are Softie PAR ratings though 

[Blown76mav]

You guys need to quit worrying about Lumens or MCD of these LED's and look at the Par rating. If you guys are serious, you need to google "Lumens Vs Par". Then find someone with a PAR meter (if you can), start buying LEDS, and measure. Once you have some solid readings, post back. I would love for someone to come up with a PAR rating for different brand/wavelength LED's.

Lots of trial and error getting the colors the way you want. Because Lumens/MCD does not equal PAR. I think you will find it quite difficult to find the right combo of colors, to meet your required PAR, and Lumens for each color to balance.

Hence the reason prebuilt fixtures are so expensive, and come in small sizes.

Supplementing your reef with different colors of LED is a cool way to bring out certain colors, and something I will be experimenting with. But I will still need my good old T-5's, and Halides for the Photosynthetic radiation.

Plus, your worried about saving money. In the long run how much have you saved? How much energy is this fixture going to consume VS Halides VS the start up cost (labor + parts + research). After a bit of time with the PAR meter, I think you will find the required LED's are expensive. More than its worth.

But, by all means. Give this a shot. Point light sources make a reef look so much cooler with the shimmer. LED's are cool to begin with. Like I said, I want someone to post a scientific result of PAR for each LED.

I agree PAR is important, but Higher Lumens/MCD = Higher Par.  Kelvin is another thing to consider as well.  But as it seems the white LED's are in the 6500K range and the Blue are in the 20,000K range.  Seems we have seen these numbers somewhere before.....  As far as cost there is no denying that a LED cost less to run than a T5 or a MH.  Both of these use Watts, a LED uses Miliwatts  WAY less electric to run them.

I was pointing out that there are less expensive LED's that will do the same job as the Cree Stars, you just have to do a little work.

[harleyrider]

I agree Blown, we have this wonderful thing called the internet, research can make you sweat though i guess right lol

[cyberwollf]

All the research is out there just gatta find it.  there are a couple of Folks on RC with spectrum analyzers and everything. The isn't an led in the 5mm package that can give you the output of the Cree's. You have no idea of what the binning qualities were on the eBay stuff. With the huge amount of heat produced by the Crees and other 3+ watt how could a normal package led dissipate the heat. Odds are the LEDs there are WAY overdriven (if they actually meet the spec quoted) and they will die quick.  Source of great info and diy led design was pdelcast on RC. Or ANYTHING Evil666 posts in on nanoreef.  

[TechGuy]

I agree PAR is important, but Higher Lumens/MCD = Higher Par.  Kelvin is another thing to consider as well.  But as it seems the white LED's are in the 6500K range and the Blue are in the 20,000K range.  Seems we have seen these numbers somewhere before.....  As far as cost there is no denying that a LED cost less to run than a T5 or a MH.  Both of these use Watts, a LED uses Miliwatts  WAY less electric to run them.

I was pointing out that there are less expensive LED's that will do the same job as the Cree Stars, you just have to do a little work.

No, higher lumens does not equal PAR. Not with every LED anyways, or every light source for that matter. Kelvin has more an effect on PAR than lumens I agree. Because of the wavelength that your coral will respond to.

I'm aware of the power consumption. But your power supplies use watts to drive the LEDS. The point was the ridiculous start up cost. The time and labor required, its just not worth it IMHO.

Not only the time and money. But has anyone really seen the LONG term results of an LED lit tank? Quite the gamble I think.

But like I said. I want to see some end results.