The death of a Reef Tank and Hopeful Resurection

[Twizted1]

I started a 180 gallon mixed reef tank in February of 2012. Now in Jan 2014 I am facing many challenges. In the beginning I done tons of research. Talked to everyone I could, asking all the questions I could think of. I eventually took what I was told, and what I thought I could do without and started up. Things looked great for a year or so. Then I noticed a patch of a turf like algae. Was no big deal. Just a little tuft. Over the course of a few months it spread and spread, until it was over all the rock work. on 3-28-13 my PO4 was .08 ppm.
These pictures where taken 4-28-13

No ro/di unit. All my water came from the hose.

Started doing small water changes to suck some of it out. Would look better for a few days.

The right side of the tank wasn't real bad. But it was spreading.

At this point all my corals looked good. Everything was growing good. So I just went with it. Corals look good so cant be all that bad. But it was time to start taking this seriously. I wanted this algae gone. So 4-28-13 I added a gfo reactor.in June I installed a Ro/Di unit, mixing barrels and built me a small fish room/closet. In about July of 2013 I added a skimmer. Yes before that point I was not running a skimmer. I was using an Algae Turf Scrubber only. I have nothing against using an ATS. But there is no substitute for a good quality skimmer. Over the next several months I did weekly 30-50 gallon water changes. Puling out the gha every week. I can remember thinking, I can beat this! I have taken all these steps! This will be gone in no time.
Then I had a tank crash. Coral started dying. My anemones started looking bad. Lost some snails. And started to get very frustrated. The first thing to do in this case is check my parameters.
9-21-13 Alk 7.7, Cal 350, Mag 1100. Started dosing by just pouring a little 2 part in everyone in awhile. Then at the beginning of Dec things went down hill in a big way.
12-6-13 Alk 7.7, Cal 415, Mag 1000
Started checking these same levels every day and dosing accordingly. Not knowing that my mag test kit was wrong.
12-23-13 Alk 8.8, Cal 435, Mag 1670 off the charts. PO4 .11
So I am ready to quit. I have lost most of my prize corals. Hair algae, slime algae, and all kinds of nasties all over the tank.
1-14-14








As of 1-14-14 I have gotten rid of most of the coral in the tank. 3 Anenamies and had 1 fish casualty. RIP dottyback. I'm sorry.
Next step is to get rid of a few more pieces. then pull the clams and rest of the coral. 

[Bucknutz]

Can't wait to see it come back to life with all the knowledge you've gained since you started.

[Marine_freak]

Hello Kole tang, lawn mower Benny,sea hare, and oh about. 500 blue legs.... Problem solved.

[METZCOOL]

Hopefully not Bryopsis turf algae

[Ashlar]

A buddy of mine who owns a fish store swears by yellow tangs and red-legged mexican hermit crabs.

Check the video embedded here..

http://franks-tanks.com/blog/franks-tanks-algae-eaters/

[Steve]

I know alot of people don't keep hermits, but I love them, they are work horses on algae.

[Twizted1]

I have tried a couple see hares and tangs and crabs and lots of snake oils. The bottom line is you need to fix the source of the problem. I am going to go step be step of my attempt. Will I win? We shall see.

Hopefully not Bryopsis turf algae

Its not bryopsis for sure. I've seen it. Two different algaes.

[Steve]

Did the sailfin eat it Joe?

[METZCOOL]

I have lanthnum chloride if you want to dose, ive used it and it took care of a major hair algae outbreak I had in short time. Here is helpful link:
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1910701

[METZCOOL]

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1910701

[Twizted1]

Did the sailfin eat it Joe?

He did. But just couldn't keep up with it.

I have lanthnum chloride if you want to dose, ive used it and it took care of a major hair algae outbreak I had in short time. Here is helpful link:
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1910701

That is the next step. I am picking some up on Friday. If I need any more I'll keep you in mind. Thanks for the offer.

[lazylivin]

Thank you for sharing pictures and your journey. With your persistence I am convinced you will beat it!

[merlin3]

Get parameters in check,  clean up crew,  peroxide,  can be beat. 

[CoralBeauties]

+1 for the lanthium chloride.  My tank was a carbon copy of yours.  I started dosing the Lan/ chlor and within a month or so I went from forests of gha to a few patches.  Most of it is on the back glass.  I do now have some cyno.  Not real sure how to tackle it but I would say you have alot of dissolved organics.  I feel that is my current problem.  Be careful removing the gha.  If I scrub it off the rocks and glass with a tooth brush and let the filter pick up as much as it can all of my corals look terrible for a couple of days and one of my milli will loose most of its color.  The algae must be releasing something the corals hate.  You are not alone.
Jeff

[Twizted1]

+1 for the lanthium chloride.  My tank was a carbon copy of yours.  I started dosing the Lan/ chlor and within a month or so I went from forests of gha to a few patches.  Most of it is on the back glass.  I do now have some cyno.  Not real sure how to tackle it but I would say you have alot of dissolved organics.  I feel that is my current problem.  Be careful removing the gha.  If I scrub it off the rocks and glass with a tooth brush and let the filter pick up as much as it can all of my corals look terrible for a couple of days and one of my milli will loose most of its color.  The algae must be releasing something the corals hate.  You are not alone.
Jeff

Form what I understand, when you dose lith chloride. It drops your PO4 to fast. And that's one of things that corals react to. They are used the level of PO4. I am removing all of my corals, also my clams. That way I have less to worry about.
As for the cyno it is from the release of nutrients from the death of the gha. I will worry about it when it comes. If. You can use chemi clean to get rid of it. Follow the directions carefully. And you will not have a problem.

[CoralBeauties]

I didnt have any issues with using the L/C.  I used 5ml of it mixed with about a quart of water.  Then dripped in 500 ml of the mixture into my overflow that empties directly into my skimmer.  I did this daily for a good month or so with no adverse effect to my corals.  In fact I am actually getting my colors back in my sps and starting to get some polyp extension.  Growth is still very slow.  I just now put online a carbon reactor to see if it might help pull out the doc.
Jeff

[lazylivin]

Jeff what brand you used? How do you drip it into your skimmer? Did you go through a whole in the skimmer to cup to drop into the body or some other way? Also did you have to use a filter sock or does the skimmer pick it all up

[CoralBeauties]

I purchased mine on amazon.  It is SeaKlear Phosphate Remover CR.  I am dripping my dose from a hospital style feeding bag that I hang over my tank and drip directly into my overflow.  My overflow feeds my skimmer direct so I believe all the precipitate is removed directly through the skimmer.  I ran a filter sock at first filtering the output from the skimmer but never noticed any precititate in the sock.  I am still dosing a couple of times a week.  I did notice that after a month or so of dosing every day the few frags I had left were loosing color so I dropped back the frequency of dosing and it has seemed to help with color.  My greens are good but havent been able to get the purples back yet.  I would recommend it to anyone who is experiencing green hair algae.  My problem was I waited too long before I found this product and it continues being a fight to get things back in line.
Jeff

[Wall_Tank]

Phosphate is bad, but don't drive it to zero.   It can be equally bad.   I would recommend that before going on any phosphate removal plan, I would have a good photometer to test your results.

[chromiumlux]

Thanks for sharing. I recently went through this with my tank. It was the new rock I had added a while back. Good old hitchhiking algae. I had 2 different turf algae, 1 confirmed bryopsis strain, and hair algae galore. Surprisingly enough, The rock I had cured for about 9 months from a previous outbreak had no signs of the algae outbreak. so, the new rock is sitting outside in the snow and deep freeze. Lost a few acros, however, The issue seems to be in check and old rock is clean.
I attribute my recent algae problems to poor husbandry and overfeeding. I will post some pics in my build thread today or tomorrow of what it looked like before, during, after.

[Twizted1]

Pulled all the coral that I could out of the tank. Still have some zoas that I can't seem to get off the rock. The pink birds nest is full of gha. So it will stay. Hopefully it makes it through. I think it will. I checked my PO4 and NO3 and both read 0. So it seems I was at the end of the fight. I still have gha so I know there is still PO4 in the system. But it is being consumed by the gha just as fast as it's being released. So me changing my gfo every 2 weeks really helped. I am going to dose chemi clean tomorrow after this clam I sold is picked up. Here are some pics.






My temp holding tank. A little cloudy from drooping something in the sand.

[Twizted1]

The gha is looking a lot better. But I still have some in the tank. I have been changing my gfo every other week and filling the reactor as full as I can get it. I am still reading 0 po4 according to the Hanna checker. But there are obviously still some nutrients in the tank. It has been almost a month, so I am going to move to a little more aggressive approach. I started today with vodka dosing. I got 100 proof vodka. I started with the first dose today 2-13-14. I will slowly up the dosage until algae is gone. At least that's the plan.

[Twizted1]

Gha is just patchy. The first vodka dose was yesterday. Today I woke up to the glass covered in algae. Did my second dose today. Have to see what happens tomorrow. I am due to change gfo Sunday. Maybe it's full?

[buckeyereefer]

Have you tried scrubbing the rocks in hydrogen peroxide ? I had pretty good results. Even did rocks an frags with zoas an shrooms on them.

[Twizted1]

Have you tried scrubbing the rocks in hydrogen peroxide ? I had pretty good results. Even did rocks an frags with zoas an shrooms on them.

Yea I've done that. It's only a temporary fix in my situation. My tank went to long with out a proper skimmer among other things. As the nutrient level in the water column rose, it got to a point the water could no longer hold the nutrients. Nutrient being No3 & Po4. So the rocks absorbed those nutrients. And as the rocks became saturated, that gave way to perfect conditions for the gha. So just removing the gha is not enough. I need to nutritive the nutrients. Killing the gha's food source thus killing the gha.

[buckeyereefer]

Gotcha !!!

[CoralBeauties]

I still swear by the lanthanum dosing.  I also tried just about all the different methods.  Vodka, vinegar, sugar, biopellets, water changes out the keister, nothing seemed to work for me until I started to dose the lanthanum and recently using carbon in a reactor I have.  It has been several months of diligence but I only have a few tufts of gha and some small patches of cyno.  I started with a forest before and I was almost at the point of taking down the tank from frustration.
Jeff

[Twizted1]

I still swear by the lanthanum dosing.  I also tried just about all the different methods.  Vodka, vinegar, sugar, biopellets, water changes out the keister, nothing seemed to work for me until I started to dose the lanthanum and recently using carbon in a reactor I have.  It has been several months of diligence but I only have a few tufts of gha and some small patches of cyno.  I started with a forest before and I was almost at the point of taking down the tank from frustration.
Jeff

Lanthanum chloride is still an option. The only problem with that is, I am reading 0 PO4 with the Hana checker. And LaCl3 will only pull the PO4 that is in the water column. So it's just a game of hunting them down. With the vodka dosing I am building a biological weapon the with get to the source. At least that's the plan. Here is the schedule I am following. And info about vodka dosing. http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2008-08/nftt/index.php

[Heathcoot]

how often are you changing your water, i can go all day but i know you said you went to long without a skimmer but joe i have a beautiful tank with no skimmer on it and my stuff grows crazy, only algea is a little bit of bubble, but my emeralds take care of that just fine, second is your light led?, third do you have any sand sifting fish, wrasses in general, snails, stars, cucumbers? forth do you have a sump and whats your flow rate to your whole system you may not be slow enough through your sump for nutrient fall out if you have a fuge. i had this problem in a 210 fish only tank it took me six months to fix it but i got it by gravel siphoning a tlf phosban reactor and rearanging rock, i manually started by moving 1/3 of rock every month and a half until i fully gravel siphoned and restacked rock so it wasnt like a rock wall in the aquarium, and the reason for it getting so bad was i didnt do proper water changes on my system and i just took risk after risk i know i was messing with fire the tank was set up for 8 years and boom started gravel siphoning and it took time but i got it fixed and now that you have not a whole lot in your system and trying everything it sounds like starting with a blank canves is what you need most perameters are in check. on my 180 i did 30 gal changes every week and changed my filter sock everytime my skimmer never skimmed lol wasnt that good, i was unable to do gravel siphons tank was to packed and it was up within 6 months packed full but had 200 nassarius snails 3 wrasses and a few cucumbers and sand sifting stars.

[Twizted1]

how often are you changing your water,

I was doing them weekly. I have only done 2 small ones since starting this thread.

second is your light led?,

Yes I am running 3 AI SOL Blue's

third do you have any sand sifting fish, wrasses in general, snails, stars, cucumbers?

I have conches. Nothing else that sifts sand.

forth do you have a sump and whats your flow rate to your whole system you may not be slow enough through your sump for nutrient fall out if you have a fuge.

I do have a sump. I've never calculated flow rate. I'm running a Reflow Dart about 85% open.

I am on the down side of the problem at this point. I have come to realize I can't feed so much. It's still hard to do, but it's still hard not to over feed.

[Heathcoot]

ok well i can deff second overfeeding i had 5 large angels in that 210 2 korans a french a blueface and an anularis plus occasional majestic or regal depending if they got sold or not but huge fish eating krill cockle on the half shell and other meaty stuff, on the battle tho i started with pencil urchins, but the single most important fish that i introduced was a blue line rabbit fish! It ate so much over the 6 months it was rediculous, no scrubbing rock no anything so i focused on cleaning up the 8 year old sand bed just gravel siphoning and rearanging rock as i went, and trust me the tank wasnt the greatest. It had a euroreef skimmer +1 but other then that a simple wet/dry pump and power heads nothing more only extra was the TLF hang on phosban reactor for the combat, had a current 12 bulb t5.